Who gives a fuck where Osteen's church is located.These fear mongering lowlifes practiced this guttertrash form of Christanity for power and money.They and there sheep are the worst kind of hypocrites.This guy probably will not be the last of there leaders exposed as gay.And gay is not the sin as science closes in on conclusive evedence that it is biological.That asshole from Kansas that likes to go to funerals with signs "Fags will Burn" I'm thinking has got to have issues other than theological.It's my understanding that protestants do not believe in degree of sin like catholics.I've been told by several that sin is sin,one sin is as bad as another.Why are they so bent on gays? One can see why fear is at the center of there spirtual lives.I suspect there running scared inside about many things.While on the subject of fear,where where all the millions of flag waiving young repulican christians (so they call themselves)when there glorious president took us into Irag.Our Generals made clear we needed more troops.

Two points:

1. You Christians with your guilt trips [we are all unworthy sinners!!] can be difficult to take when you go into self-righteous mode. The way otherwise intelligent people engage in theosophical exchanges with all the seriousness of scientists talking about indisputable data- except that it comes from this arrogant, faux high-minded "let me tell you what god thinks" perspective- is truely an alarming oddity. To many of us, hearing people discuss millenium-plus old writings selectively assembled for political reasons as if they are indisputable how-to books for modern times is on par with seeing someone in a suit talking to a be-feathered, painted-faced shaman about advantages and disadvantages of magic potions. Personally, from Bush to Robertson to Koresh to Jim Jones to Applewhite to Khomeini to bin-laden to Frist to Dobson to Haggard [and on and on] I've had enough of clueless people telling me what god thinks, and I don't hold the opinions given here [ e.g., by a] in any higher regard. None of you have proven to be anything near reliable in your interpretations. So why don't you spare the rest of us any further guidance since the planet and civilization can't take much more of your wisdom.

2. Why do expect us to go easy on the worst hypocrites [going so far as to call US hypocrites for riding these people] when they have been spitting vitriol at us for so long and for no better reason than we don't conform with their [wholey inadequate] version of morality. The neocons and people from Enron, Worldcom, Halliburton, etc can destroy innocent lives in every conceivable way and you're almost silent. But let it out that someone's a liberal or a democrat, or consenting adults are doing things that hurt absolutely no one else- but which you don't approve of- and vast numbers of ideologues become vocal in their self-righteous condemnation. So don't act so shocked, indignant, and self-righteous if, when it comes to light that some of the loudest condemners are caught in the biggest acts of hypocrisy, those of us they've been disparaging loudly and enthusiastically cry "foul." We didn't put Haggard's or others who fall from grace's families in horrible these situations, they did. And our being polite isn't going make their plight any easier. If these people don't want to be attacked for their "sins," then they should refrain from attacking others, display some humility, and walk the walk.

There's a saying in my community: God don't like ugly. Haggard did ugly. And ugly boomerangs.

To make fun of the hypocrits, those who willfully misled people for money, the cons men, the stupid criminals, it's natural in this country. It's as American as apple pie.

Many people here are not Christian, and care not about a Christian standard. The more one pontificates that they are hypocrities because they are not meeting a standard they never even said they were going to meet, never ever accepted, and don't accept now, the more they are turned off by the speaker. It reinforces that "Christians are stupid" meme that runs through these boards at far too high a frequency.

The people here making fun of Haggard never claimed to be perfect, as Haggard did. They never claimed a special mission, as Haggard did. They never demonized people over religious preference or sexuality, as Haggard did. Haggard set a standard for them. Labelling Haggard a "hypocrite" seems accurate. Making jokes about it makes sense. They aren't saying "string him up."

What makes it so ripe for jokes is that it seems every time a minister/politician goes off on how some sexual behavior is depraved and how people who commit that sin, that same condemner is committing the behavior in a far more illicit and bigger way that the people condemned. It just never seems to fail. The truly holy don't shout it or run around condemning people to hell, as Haggard did. It feels like it's inevitable. The louder they scream, the more likely they are doing it, and getting off on the way the "condemning" allows them to licitly discuss what they really want to do.

It's like a cosmic joke. If you condemn, you will do.

read it here!

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jegay.htm

The religious right's political movement is not only anti gay marriage, it is anti-gay. When a member of the religious right says he doesn't hate gay people, he just wants to protect marriage, it's like an anti-Semite saying he doesn't hate Jews, he just wants to protect the media and the banks, or a racist saying he doesn't hate blacks, he just wants to protect white women.

So when a self-righteous proponent of hatred towards gays turns out to be a closet case who cheats on his wife, going on speed runs with a male prostitute, it means there is one less bigot with the pulpit and checkbook to spread hate. And that makes me happy.