sallywally, did you read the article? It's not an attack on either Obama or Clinton. There is no RW bias in that article.

It shows that McCain's Moses ad is not so subtly implying that Obama is the freaking antichrist. The ad uses many of the phrases from the Left Behind series, even when they don't work.

"If they wanted to be funny, if they really wanted to play up the idea that Obama thinks he's the Second Coming, there were better ways to do it," she says. "Why use these awkward lines like, 'And the world will receive his blessings'?"

Saying that we "worship" the messiah, the second coming, pretending we are enthralled by "the one", etc. all plays into the RW's ad and it's appeal to religious fear.

I'm rarely enthused about Dem's chances, but to see fellow Dems want to mock and disparage genuine excitement about one of our own (one who is sooooo close in policy positions to their own preferred candidate) is dumbfounding.

p.s. last time, I know there were BO and HC "fake" supporters on the boards along time ago, some of these folks were prolific and then just disappeared after things got worked out, they never managed to bash McCain, or even Bush. You know a liberal I know once called me a bad name....screw them, I will now call all liberals who disagree with me on any topic bad names, too. It will help them see my point, won't it?

You can't have Hillary without Bill and that's Barack's problem. Bill is larger-than-life and, possibly, twice as ugly but Bill has natural PRESENCE while Barack's performance just doesn't ring true. "Hush, hush, sweet Charlotte" can now be transferred to Bill Clinton as a crowd of lilliputian figures try to tie him down.

Thanks! Well said.

The idea was (allegedly) to excuse the results that were bound to favor Obama and to marginalize him as the black candidate for future contests. So the timing was perfect.

The timing may have been perfect from a political standpoint, but clearly, if you choose to use a candidate's race as a means by which to "marginalize" him, you forfeit your right to moan about it when people who share that candidate's race are offended. Generally speaking, offending African-Americans is not the best way to win nomination as the candidate of the Democratic Party. Now, if you're a Republican, on the other hand...

And still can't admit that Obama's qualfied to become president. This situation doesn't look good. For different reasons both Dukakis and Gore probably regretted letting Clinton speak at their conventions.

You gotta send me the url to obtain whatever it is that you smoke, cuz it seems to be reallll good. Your posts never really make any sense, but are highly entertaining in a surrealistic, sounds good but makes you say "whaaa" kinda way...it's sort of like reading Dylan lyrics...

...I like Dylan, so that's more of a backhanded compliment than an insult per se...

How is not being able to have Hillary without Bill, or vice versa, Barack's problem, when he's the nominee, and Joan Walsh's post was about why the baggage of Bill prevents Hillary from being the Veep?

I dunno if Obama is/isnt as magnetic as Bill, but how do you explain the 200,000 in Germany? Or, I should say, which Bette Davis film explains it?

You're absolutely right. I didn't mention him because of that albatross. That was a particularly bad war for me personally. Most definitely though, domestically, he moved the country forward in big ways. And who knows how JFK would have turned out if he had lived. Well, what a world we live in. Makes me want to pull up my dress and scream! Right after we outlaw the Republican party.

Which Bette Davis film?

I'm gonna have to go with "Of Human Bondage."

"We Democrats owe the Clintons nothing. If Bubba had any sense of shame, he would leave the world stage."

I'm glad Pres. Clinton hasn't left the world stage and is using his name and his foundation to do good works. What have you done, Obamaton? What have you contributed to the world, except trying to make sure, with your stupid comment, that Obama does NOT get elected. It is so pathetic. The former president of the United States should not get to speak at the convention. Neither should his wife who got almost as many votes as the presumptive nominee. Where do you think you are? Guantanamo Bay? Planet Obama? No, this is America!!!

could you post the link for the Time article.

I actually have overheard people saying that Obama is the anti-christ...seriously saying it.

A co-worker also said it once.

thanks for the note. And for the record, I think that full plausibility on being free from using the race card (the Clintons) would have been easier if they hadn't kept seeming to use the "he can't win because he's black" argument that was evoked in South Carolina. Even if they believed this argument (and I sort of believe they did) it could be read as racism or as opportunism, and worse, it can become a self-fulfilling prophesy, and now we're facing the mess we're in.

Disturbing.

For telling it like it is.

I have been saying what you are saying in this piece for months, and trying to alert Democrats as to the destructiveness of this electoral tactic. While Obama supporters who are in denial can ignore my insights, it is much more difficult to ignore the Editor of Salon.

When these tactics were first used by the Obama "surrogates," I said that this would eventually come back to haunt him and the Democratic Party.

As for lateagain's rather empty defense that Obama had nothing to gain - how about the Democratic nomination in a year in which the Democrats were set up for victory in the general election. Massive appeal to African American voters by such tactics, as well as other civil rights defenders who also bought in to the negative spin, was the key to Obama's victory in the primaries.

[As an aside, lateagain, I believe (in another post) you were defending Obama's arrogance by asking jebldmm, "How does it matter?" I would ask, "How can you doubt that it matters after 8 years of the arrogant Mr. Bush?" Arrogance tends to numb the mind and prevent outside sources of information from creating path correction.]

I also want to point out, what for me, reinforced this negative strategy in a most disastrous way. I wrote about it twice in Salon. It was the openly hostile threats of Douglas Wilder, Donna Brazile and others as to the havoc that would be wreaked upon the Democratic Convention if the super delegates would dare to vote for Hillary Clinton in the event that Barack Obama had slightly more elected delegates, even though that is the role of the superdelegates, and even though the primaries are a very flawed system, and even though the race was very close, and even though Hillary Clinton had more momentum at the end of the process. If Bill Clinton, and to a lesser degree, Hillary Clinton had not been weakened by impugning their civil rights records, this complementary tactic would have had much less force.

Lastly, Ms. Walsh points out the destructiveness of Democrats to their own Party. As she said, Republicans do not treat their former Presidents the way that Bill Clinton has been treated. How can the Democratic Party ever hope to gain electoral momentum when their arguably greatest President of the latter 20th Century is treated with disdain within the Party?