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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
I think this kill the Khazaks guy is one of your friends.
Israel is the most incompetent depopulater in the history of the universe given the massive expansion of the palestinian population that has taken place under it's occupation.
As usual, Mr. Levy has no problem taking liberties with the truth to push his viciously anti-Israel agenda. (By the way, even his usual allies deserted and humiliated him recently on network television over his stand on the current war.)
Now, to the point:
As the Israeli journalist Gideon Levy pointed out, the Gaza war is "maybe the only war in history against a strip of land enclosed by a fence."
OK, Salon-ers, let's see a show of hands; who believes this?
Well, those of you with your hands up, you all should know that Mr. Levy comes from a region in which ALL cities were not just fenced in, but WALLED IN until relatively recently, historically speaking.
And he know that ALL sieges, even modern ones, involve surround the target (Stalingrad and Berlin are memorable examples), cutting off supply routes, and pressuring the armed forces in that city to submit.
OK, you can put your hands down now.
Are the Palestinians ever going to wake up and realize they have been used by Hamas, and every other group and country in the middle east. I am so sick of hearing about their suffering. Of them living in refugee camps. Still living in a dream world that they are going to return to the homes. It is not going to happen. Jews were thrown out of England, Spain, Portugal, and France just to name a few. If they stayed they were forced to convert or be murdered. They picked themsleves and made new homes and communties. Of course, moving to more Northern Europe did cause many problems. Do the readers know that the Jewish population in 2,00 years remained the same. Yes, Israel fights back. If the Middle east companies had excepted Israeli statehood in 1967, I am sure Israel would have gone back to their borders. Of course, with the right to be in Jerusalem, which had been denied since the War of Independence.
The Kahan inquirey found Sharon DIRECTLY, not "indirectly" responsible for the Sabra and Shatila massacre. Easy to look up.
The Kahan inquirey found Sharon DIRECTLY, not "indirectly" responsible for the Sabra and Shatila massacre. Easy to look up.
No, *you're* wrong. Look it up. Sharon was found responsible for ignoring the danger, NOT for perpetrating the massacre, which was, of course, done by Christian Phlangists.
Don't you know? Israeli defence of any type is by definition genocide.
Israel has no strategic vision
Israel's strategic vision is simple: peace. More specifically, the goal is to build on the peace agreements with Egypt & Jordan by reaching ones with the Palestinian Authority and Syria. Hamas would like to stop this, and to that end they've been shooting rockets at Israel.
When it finally ends its assault, Hamas will emerge from the rubble, Iran and Hezbollah will be empowered, Egypt and Palestinian Authority leader Mahmoud Abbas will be weakened, and America's standing in the region will be lower than ever.
What's LEFT of Hamas will emerge from the rubble. Hezballah's had some manners slapped into her, evidenced by her recent restraint. Egypt and Abbas will be much stronger, especially if the Gazan population rejects Hamas and restores the legitimate PA rule.
I agree with Kamiya, though, that Iran will remain a problem. Fortunately, Barack Obama agrees too.
Full speed ahead IDF.
You made good rebuttals to the "fenced-in" quote.
But you lost all credibility with this gem:
Don't you know? Israeli defence of any type is by definition genocide.
Defense against despicable deaths of civilians is to ... kill 10 to 100 times as many civilians?
How'd that work out in historically?
Also, your first post about fenced-in cities under siege. Good historical precedents, however you ought to consider the current Gaza situation's similarities to another famous historical event that you may have heard of: The Warsaw Ghetto.
Cheers
How'd that work out in historically?
Sorry, I don't understand the question.
Gaza situation's similarities to another famous historical event that you may have heard of: The Warsaw Ghetto
That's an obscene comparison. The Jews of the Warsaw Ghetto didn't make war on German civilians, and were entirely innocent.
>> How'd that work out in historically?
> Sorry, I don't understand the question.
Here is a reference (thanks to previous poster):
> http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-why-do-they-hate-the-west-so-much-we-will-ask-1230046.html
>> Gaza situation's similarities to another famous historical
>> event that you may have heard of: The Warsaw Ghetto
> That's an obscene comparison. The Jews of the Warsaw Ghetto
> didn't make war on German civilians, and were entirely
> innocent.
The dead Palestinian civilians are (were?), by definition as civilians, equally innocent.
BTW, I just noticed "obscene", I'd read as "obscure". Interesting.
I'll grant what happened in Warsaw *was* obscene. But I see obscenities in Gaza now too. Guess I have the distance to be objective and disinterested (at least not uninterested!).
Also, returning to your siege comparison on fenced-in vs walled-in, I think you missed something else.
In your examples, the walls were *defensive*, Gaza is not "protected" by the fence.
Forgive my clumsy quoting...
Cheers,
Really?
Coulda fooled me, but then what do I know.
Sorry, I don't have the time right now for Robert Fisk. Let's stick to Salon & the article at hand.
The dead Palestinian civilians are (were?), by definition as civilians, equally innocent.
Palestinian civilians elected Hamas, which took control of Gaza, which was used to launch attacks on Israeli civilians. The Palestinian civilians are suffering now just as German civilians suffered when the Nazis took control of Germany, and used it to launch attacks on other countries. Actually, what the Palestinians are suffering now is nothing compared to what the Germans suffered in WW2.
In your examples, the walls were *defensive*, Gaza is not "protected" by the fence.
True. But I presume your point is that civilians can't escape, so other than semantics... I'm right.
Much of the initial coverage about Fort Hood turned out to be wrong. Is there anything wrong with that?
The accountability imposed by another country for the CIA's kidnapping and torture reveals much about our own.
Fox News' morning show plays to type, talking about whether Muslims in the Army should face "special debriefings"
219 Democrats and one Republican join in favor of the legislation, which passed by a narrow margin
The survivor and author is upset about comparisons some on the right are making to genocide
Salon headlines in your mailbox
