Conditional apologies, anyone?

except when it comes to prosecuting CIA agents for carrying out orders to torture.

Nuremberg Defense is still operable in DC.

Otherwise, however, it looks like Obama has shown much more courage than we feared. Good for him if only names are redacted.

The devil can be in the details, but I feel very good about what appears to have been decided by our president.

I must say I'm pleased by this. How much do you think pressure from the "Constitutional left" had to do with this?

From Obama

I also believe that in a dangerous world, the United States must sometimes carry out intelligence operations and protect information that is classified for purposes of national security. I have already fought for that principle in court and will do so again in the future.

Can you say, "State Secrets"?

Simultaneously, and certainly with the intend to placate angry intelligence officials, Attorney General Eric Holder has "informed CIA officials [though not necessarily Bush officials] who used waterboarding and other harsh interrogation tactics on terror suspects that they will not be prosecuted," and Obama announced the same thing in his statement. [emphasis added]

That's what I wanted to know.

Now, back to reading the rest of the post...

or, we've seen this sort of thing before.

Obama's statement: http://tinyurl.com/d24q53

And note he said "certain memos" so one must wonder if any others exist.

Second, in a typical one-two punch, this placates most of the left while at the same time letting the American people know that torturers can get away with torturing as long as they were 'just following orders' lawfully (?) given at the time.

Hmmm, did that work at Nuremberg?

Obama also says:

"First, the interrogation techniques described in these memos have already been widely reported. Second, the previous Administration publicly acknowledged portions of the program ¿ and some of the practices ¿ associated with these memos. Third, I have already ended the techniques described in the memos through an Executive Order. Therefore, withholding these memos would only serve to deny facts that have been in the public domain for some time."

So the spin is that these memos contain nothing that we already don't know and are being released for mainly historical purposes. Because, of course, "(T)his is a time for reflection, not retribution."

Bottom line: Yeah, we tortured -- and everyone gets away with it.

Pardon me for not celebrating.

Plus, part of me wonders if they were scared into doing the right thing by that NSA leak today. After all, if that could leak out, why not these memos?

Unless and until every last one of the preceding Admin's War Criminals are prosecuted, POTUS*! is equally culpable/complicit as far as I'm concerned.

I'm very sorry if you find that sentiment offensive.

While I'm actually gobsmacked that the memoranda are being released, and otherwise share your enthusiasm for Obama's decision, there are grounds for criticism in his statement - not the least of which is that he appears to be framing this release as an exception to the general national security rule, based on reasons that appear to apply in other cases where national security has been relied on to prevent transparency (e.g., in several other court proceedings).

I thought it was a part of all military training that an officer understood the obligation NOT to follow orders that he or she understood to be illegal. Whether or not that extends into civilian organizations like CIA (although I understand that much of the torture was carried out by Blackwater contractors) Obama has effectively reversed a precedent set at Nuremburg, that "I was just following orders" is no defense.

Just so long as he doesn't extend the no prosecutions policy upward to those who were 'just giving orders.' But who really think that he will ever pursue Yoo, Bybee et. al., let alone Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Gonzales, Ashcroft, Mukasey, Rice...

Geez, the list of war criminals is so long. :-(

While we have to wait and see how much is redacted or not in these latest memos. It's clear that there will be no prosecutions of any kind, neither CIA or former Bush officials. If the CIA torturers are to be let off the hook, I have no doubt those that ordered torture will go free as well. Obama has giving any former Bushie an arguable defense. If those that actually did the torture broke no laws, then I broke no laws by ordering it. Thanks Obama, thanks for nothing. So much for restoring the rule of law and holding violators accountable. You make me sick and I voted for you. Won't make that mistake again.

If anybody, regardless of station, told me I could beat the crap out of a defenseless opponent, I would be pretty incredulous. However, I'm very happy they opted for so few redactions.

It was making me physically sick.

HMMM

Conditional apologies, anyone?

-- cresttwo

You think people who perform torture have "cajonies". And you think that the President of the United States should be apologized to when people ask him to do the right thing - on our behalf, in our name - and he actually comes through on occasion?

it's soooo important that he got this one right, or mostly right.

Yeah, the timing of the leak about the wiretapping of the Congressman might seem to have helped grease the skids here, but it really looks like the decision to release the memos and protect the CIA was made yesterday or earlier. Can it really be doubted that without pressure from the Greenwalds, we would have had a worse result today?

I love this precedent.

"You can bet that the release of the memos will set up a firestorm of debate today." I sure hope this trumps the Mexico visit.

No one should be surprised that Obama-Holder were going to protect the lower level officials because both said it several times.

If you smoke marijuana, you're a dangerous criminal who deserves to be locked up in prison for years to keep you from harming anybody. If you're a government employee who tortures people, you were just following orders and shouldn't suffer any consequences.

Guess they don't really have much choice. If they don't protect these scumbags, nobody will do their bidding next time they need someone tortured.

What's really funny to me is the idea that these slimeballs are worthy of respect, other than the "respect" you'd give any other armed thug who's pointing a gun at you.