Just a quick one to clarify. In my last post I was only taking the piss, as we say in England. I don't know what part, if any, Arabs played a part in 9/11. All I know is that they sure didn't plan it.

Cool. It wasn't directed at you in particular. I just feel the urge to destroy myths as they appear, and Allah knows how many fucking myths have been shoved down American and British throats by their Zionist-controlled presses.

The United States signed the Convention Against Torture on Apr. 18, 1988 and ratified it on Oct. 21, 1994. I'm assuming that what you were looking at was out of date. Here's an alternate link:

http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/ratification/9.htm

Whether a ratified treaty is the "supreme law of the land," as Article VI of the Constitution states, is more complex than it may seem. First, the President and 2/3 of the Senate must consent to ratification (which was accomplished here). Second, you need to see if the treaty is self-executing or not. Self-executing treaties have immediate and direct effect as binding US domestic law, while non-self-executing treaties require further action by Congress. Determining whether a treaty is self-executing can be a tricky business, but since the Convention Against Torture was explicitly non-self-executing, we can skip over all that.

The upshot is that Congress needed to 'translate' the terms of the treaty into US statutes for it to have effect under US law. (So far) Glenn has provided links to some such statutes, but none of these seem to translate Article 7 of the CAT, which is the article that imposes the obligation to prosecute. Unless somebody has a link to a statute I don't know about, my understanding is that binding US law does not contain the obligation to prosecute, contrary to the title of the Glenn's article.

HOWEVER, even though Article 7 is not binding US law yet, the US is still legally obligated to prosecute under international law. We have an obligation to other countries to either extradite or prosecute our war criminals. So, if the Obama Administration fails to investigate, it will still be acting illegally. The difference is in the remedy: instead of a US citizen filing a complaint in a domestic court, a State Party to the CAT must file a complaint to the CAT Committee. Not quite as satisfying, I know, but it's not nothing. Hope that helps.

Does anybody remember what he actually DID?

-- Elephantman

Yeah, Asswipe, I do.

He got waterboarded and then confessed to kidnapping the Lindburg baby.

Arguments like the one you have just put together, applying the law in service of the greater good, are precisely why laws and lawyers are critical to a just and civil world.

And precisely why the wealthy and powerful work so hard to nullify the law and marginalize lawyers. They invariably succeed in places like Egypt and Colombia. The choice before us is whether we want to be like those countries, or like the America we want to be.

Thanks very much, Glenn, for making the choice so clear.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/B/BUSH_PARDONS?SITE=OHLIM&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Bush commutes sentences of former US border agents

WASHINGTON (AP) -- In his final acts of clemency, President George W. Bush on Monday commuted the prison sentences of two former U.S. Border Patrol agents whose convictions for shooting a Mexican drug dealer ignited fierce debate about illegal immigration.

I'll swallow the "final acts" bit Tuesday afternoon.

I asked a long time ago for someone to define anti-Semitism for me, and no one would. Would you like to take a shot? Because as far as I can tell, "anti-Semitism" is a word used to put Jews above all others, as first among equals. Because bigotry against Jews is worse than bigotry against any other ethnic, racial, or religious group.

These pro-Israel web activist groups have been around for years. I know, because I now get my news from non-Zionist controlled sources. But it is a perfect example of the inherent dishonesty of a large segment of the Jewish population, wouldn't you say? So now, instead of someone "Jewing down" your prices, we can say someone is "Jewing up" the comments section. Because God for fucking bid we play fair with one another. That sentiment seems to be anathema to a large segment of the Jewish population, don't ya think? Maybe all those "anti-Semitic" ancestors of ours from Eastern Europe were on to something. Maybe they saw things and experienced things we are forbidden to acknowledge, if even in our own minds.

What makes you think Jews did some awful thing to me? I don't understand what you are getting after.

Justice is absolute, regardless of the outcome of this incident it can be assured that justice will not be done.

Law is not seperate from politics, law is politics. What laws go into action are purely a calculation of political persons weighing the political will of their constituants.

Justice is the eternal judgement of gods and men or ethics, law is the flawed attempt by politicians to express justice in society.

We hope for justice, but all we can ever achieve is law.

The law on the issue is much more muddled then Mr. Greenwald would hold. What would ammount to justice is perhaps clearer to some, but again, it is unlikely that any will see that justice done.

If the law can be made to call for justice we might see further embarassment for an already shamed administration, but the punishment is likely to fall far short of what some would hope for, and far exceed what still others demand.

Hence the political will is the thing. What do the people, the ultimate arbitor of justice in society demand. If the number calling for blood exceeds those who call for freedom, and those who ask to simply move beyond, blood will be found. Again however, that has nothing to do with justice, mearly the political will commanding law to do its bidding.