If I bash Southerners, it's the ones what deserve it. As a native and still Southerner, it has caused me no end of grief in my lifetime that the most pernicious of destructive political forces we have faced in the lifetime of our country have been my conservative white neighbors, and not so much them, as the manipulative elites posing to lead conservative white Southerners.

There's almost no effort to harm our nation and undermine the unity of the country and the strengths embodied in the liberal Enlightenment achievement that was and is the Constitution (imperfect, yet so valued) which doesn't count conservative white Southern elites among its leaders.

On the other hand, those same vicious elites are the first to step up to beg Uncle Sam for those sweet, sweet federal dollars flowing to the South from other, more developed, more prosperous states.

And who the hell were those elites to declare which nation our enslaved citizens were to be a part of? If the slavers wanted to leave and have their own nation instead of war, maybe we should have granted that small and hopeless group a section of the Florida keys, so that they could die off quietly. They had no right to attempt to steal millions of lives, and they were immoral in the highest to convince so many of the ordinary whites into their false and bloody cause, which thank God was "Lost".

So as someone who has had to deal with the arrogant boasting of right wing Southern political shysters and worthless movements my entire life, from the small minded oafs still bickering about evolution to the fake 'militia' movements of the 1990's trying to give white supremacists an alternative way of opposing Clinton to the GOP Senators who gladly kill off the U.S. auto industry so that their states alone can subsidize foreign companies, I will be among the first to mock their fake and hollow boasts of war and rebellion.

I "ditto" your response to Clockwork Smurf.

I agree that, knowingly or not, it employs the MO of the Concerned Troll.

As opposed to the fulminating weak-wits who provide us daily with the pleasure of their company, CS is pleasant, good-natured, ostensibly well-informed, and shrewdly pragmatic.

It's a Sensible Moderate who wanders over to the banks of the Sea of Deviance with fishing tackle and a soft-brimmed hat, for the altruistic purpose of gently and mildly explaining to us that we all have blundered into a riptide of absurd idealism and delusion that will deservedly sweep us into oblivion.

But do we hark to the sober, reasoned wisdom offered by this harbinger of common-sense and moderation? No, we do not!

I don't, anyway. I scoop up handfuls of the Waters of Delusion and throw them at the would-be savior. And I'll hurl clams at it if I come across any before I'm pulled out too far.

But if they don't it is and was their choice to make, having been given the power by the American people to use their judgement to do what is best for the nation.

The oath of office is to uphold and protect the Constitution and the laws of the land. Why is that so hard for you folks to understand? It's written in english, after all, not Swahili.

I loved the simple, effort-less way in which Greenwald proved it's an obligation for our next president to prosecute the torturers. Bravo.

We could take the Smurf's,

Prosecutorial discretion is a cornor stone of American Jurisprudence.

as an indication of further penetration of Glenn's argument into mainstream discourse. The movement of an issue from deviancy into acceptable debate (or, whatever words Rosen/Hallin used).

I can't remember who called it in these threads, but someone noted that when all else failed we'd see the words, Prosecutorial discretion. I could only laugh. We ain't there yet, but it appears we're making progress.

in this quote from Susan Crawford.

The techniques they used were all authorized, but the manner in which they applied them was overly aggressive and too persistent.

Someone please explain to me how wrong I am; how it will be Rummy and Haynes in the dock, not just some low-level grunts. Because I would love to be wrong about this, but that quote certainly looks like an attempt to isolate criminal responsibility to the low-level troops who applied the techniques, rather than the officials who authorized them.

Mere pretenders. The nerve!

-- Pedinska

For the record, Pedinska, I was a bit miffed at Jebbie's cheapening of the Voles. I just happen to be in a quiet and self-reflective mood today so I chose not to scold or to even comment. I didn't want you to think that the offending comment went by with out notice, though.

I explicitly brought up your foolishness about now we are no longer a country of laws due to Pelosi pulling impeachment.

Like an idiot, you claim that if we enforce the law sometimes, then we are 'a nation of laws'. In other words, as long as the kids smoking weed go to jail we are a nation of law.

Bull-fucking-shit. If the law is to be the king, then the law must be followed. The democratic leadership gave Bush Jr. a very public pass on anything early on. Glenn wrote several articles criticizing that move and now you claim is was OK. Horse shit.

So change the subject if you like. Readers here know exactly what I wrote. Be a man for once and actually argue the point brought up. Or simply shut up. ... You and I may not like the *job* that Pelosi did concerning impeachment, to say the least. But she is the speaker of the house. She gets to set the agenda, like it or not.

Pelosi's job was to block impeachment so Bush could get away with murder????? Jesus on a stick, that is stupid.

One thing I can say for your brother. He more often than not walked the walk when it came to following his stated belief in Peace. You, on the other hand can't seem to reign in your bizarre attitude that someone disagreeing with you does not constitute a personal attack.

So either learn to read and comprehend what someone says and argue on point. Or expect more people to ignore you and think you the fool.

-- KB4Hire

Now the Bush-lover goes for the whine that he has been "attacked". You have not been called the god-damn-bush-supporting neo-con that you are yet. ... There consider it done.

KB4bush, I literally hate people who support war criminals as you do. It is enabling. It is enabling the next president to do as bad or even worse.

You are like the god damn Democratic Congress that allowed Trueman to go to war without the constitutionally required act of Congress. He could have gotten one, most believe. But congress gave him a pass and look what has happened since.

Damn you president worshipers are worse than bible thumping Evangelicals.