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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
How do you define "Zionism"?
Zionism refers to a belief beginning in the 1890s that the Jews should form a homeland in Israel. Israel has existed for 60 years. Questioning Zionism at this point is like questioning the Whig Party.
The issue is over. Israel exists.
If you claim Israel should be disbanded and the 7 million Israelis resettled to other countries, there is little for us to talk about.
Criticism of Israel is clearly not always anti-Semitic. I have many criticisms of Israel. I think this Gaza attack was botched and beyond what could reasonably constitute an appropriate response to the Gaza shelling. But I would like to know more facts (and hope journalists are let in soon).
However critics of Israel who claim they aren't anti-Semitic aren't necessarily not anti-Semitic. People looked for reasons to de-legitimize and hate Jews long before Theodr Herzl was born.
That is the point. Zionists use and promote antisemitic stereotypes to further their agenda, just like the trolls do here, like WinSmith and its "arguments" that always have to mention The Protocols and "Jewish Bankers". The founders of Zionism used those stereotypes to strengthen their arguments as well.
Like I said in the post, root cause is probably not appropriate, but catalyst is. There are people who are racist and hate Jews because they perceive them as different. Other people see the actions of Israel as appalling, and then the bigots out there manipulate this perception and focus it on World Jewry, and through America's support and cover for Israeli atrocities, focus it on American citizens, breeding both antisemitism and anti-Americanism.
Both sides do it. The Lobby tries its best to conflate Palestine, Iran and The War on Terror so that Americans will foster negative perceptions about Iran and Arabs, as well as trying to get them to sympathize with and relate to Israel's policies. AQ tries to conflates Zionism with both Judaism and American Militarism so that pissed off Arabs looking for someone to point the finger at will foster negative perceptions about both Jews and Americans, regardless of any dissent that might exist. Zionists also conflate criticism of Israel and Zionism with Judaism and antisemitism in order to strengthen their perceived need of a "Jewish State" as well as making it look attractive for Jews looking to escape a world full of antisemites. According to Mearsheimer's recent article, The Changing Face of Israel the Israelis had better become more attractive to Jews, or they'd better start breeding more, lest they want to become an apartheid religious state run by Israel's exploding Orthodox Jew population:
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/12/12/the_changing_face_of_israel/
Oh look, the Dutch are protesting, it must be because they all hate Jews and hate Israel, so goes the media line. Some might actually be antisemitic, but some might be protesting Zionism and Israeli foreign policy. Either way, it is ALWAYS the former to the Zionist, but when Osama Bin Laden says the same thing they say it is because Osama is antisemitic. Thank goodness the Jews have Israel to escape to in order to get away from the world that hates them, due to thousand year old conspiracies, and not due to bigots successfully manipulating perceptions and mapping negative perceptions about Zionism unto World Jewry, Americans, Europeans, and the other two major Abrahamic religions.
Glenn,
I pretty much agree with everything you are writing on this subject. Hamas is truly a dangerous radical group and I wouldn't be surprised if they actually invite attacks on their own people. Such attacks on the civilian palestinian people only emboldens their group. What I'm saying is that Hamas is so radical that they will fire rockets from civilian tagets, with no concern of the welfare of their own people. When Israel fires back from where they saw rockets being fired, they kill schoolchildren. This in turn is used as propaganda. Here's a question: Have you ever thought that Israel's concession of settlements in the Gaza was purely a strategical move? Think about it, they have concentrated their enemies in a small area. It's like "sure take this land back, so then we can bomb you safely away from our people." Part of me thought that the second they were turning over these settlements.
What the fuck? Did Ron Paul lose his seat? You had better back off that 525 if Dr. No still is in the congress.
WinSmith:
You are nailing Glennnnnnn's clear bias. His response has been lame. He has no answer to our observation that he and his minions purposefully lack any sense of CONTEXT or history or perspective regarding the last week in Gaza. The intensity of their rage is telling. You know it and they would never admit it.
Mooser:
That was a serious post. I was pleasantly surprised. Much better than being the class clown.
Your post should answer the noodnick who couldn't understand how my Grandmother did not like Israel. She was like the families you describe. She was tall and blond and born in Western Pennsylvania, a big Pirates fan, the eldest of 9 and the only one to go to college. She resented the coarseness and crudeness she saw in both recent immigrants and Israelis just like your relatives dismissed the recent immigrants in their midst. How dare those pesky Israelis make such a stink and maybe jepardize the world's few remainig Jews all over again! Didn't they know we were supposed to be innocuous and quiet instead of making a big fuss and drawing the goyem's attention to us? Luckily, her only child to survive and have children, my Mum, visited Israel late in her life and immediately recognized her prejudices were wrong. You have been ranting here on a daily basis against "Zionists" and I have been wondering what fuels the intensity of your anger. It seems you grew up in a home, like mine, where observant Jews were ridiculed and the K word was much in vogue. We were supposed to assimilate and instead of Schmuel and Rivka we were named Stanley and Rose. It sounds like you were steered into this path of total assimilation and I hope it has made you happy. I think I am fortunate that I was able to read up on the history of our people, those who assimilated, those who were murdered, those who fought and those who built a great nation here and in Israel. I am fortunate that I finally met some real Israelis when I was in college, and, later, as a veteran, share experiences with Israeli friends who survived as soldiers over there. I think you are mistaken to lump all of Israel's friends together as "Zionists" and use that adjective as if it were a dirty word. Like Glenn, you then become that Jew these bigots can pat on the head. You have become one of the token Jews they can like. You sound pretty young and you may still have a few new things to learn about Judiasm and Israel and yourself, my frem. I certainly do. If you want to learn about a mensch or two why not google Daniel Kahneman, one of Israel's Nobels. Look at his life. Moshe Dayan was a mensch too.
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Salon headlines in your mailbox
