Johann Hari in the UK Independent has a fine summary of the actual blow-by-blow history of Israel/Palestine relations since the 2005 cease-fire:

http://tinyurl.com/6tn6n9

I'd love to hear Goldfarb explain what he means by this statement:

'because it's not clear that they are rational, at least not like us '

Can you call him out on this one?

Glenn, searing as always - this really gets at the heart of the matter of how we create The Other.

or more to the point - you write: "for those who insist that others put themselves in the position of a resident of a)Sderot or b)Gaza -- as though that will, by itself, prove the justifiability of a)the Israeli or b)the Palestinian attack -- the idea literally never occurs to them that they ought to imagine what it's like to live under 'foreign occupation' for much more than a)4 decades or b)2000 years --- No thought is given to what it is like, what emotions it generates, what horrible acts start to appear justifiable, when you have enemies who control you and your life, one which builds walls around you, imposes the most intensely humiliating conditions on your daily life, blockades your land so that you're barred from exiting and prevented from accessing basic nutrition and medical needs for your children to the point where a substantial portion of the underage population suffers from stunted growth and (may I ad) tries to 'extinguish' you!

I never would be able to write such clever "stuff" and I never would be able to get myself to either support a) or b) - but I am not stupid either and I understand, that I would have to pick b) if I am one of these "emotional supporters" of Israel.

But why did you pick a)??

Do you have any emotional, cultural or religious attachments to Israel that make you see it as more than just another foreign country or is it just, that you belong to the "Anti Dick Cheney/John Bolton/National Review/neocon ideology tribe' as you have confessed before?

Is it all just 'politics' for you??!

"Alan Bennett, your wording needs amendment."

If Ms maureenodonnell you were to say that to the only Alan Bennet I know about, the esteemed British writer would kick your butt all around Mornington Crescent, London and when you were lying in the street reach down and ask if you would like a nice cup of tea and perhaps a couple of rich tea biscuits to go with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_J0XtWtloWE

By the way, are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the American Communist Party?

-- zenwick

That cheap shot was beneath you. Glenn has explained in detail why he asked the question about emotional ties and his explanation was legitimate. Can you say the same of your's?

Jebbie, I think you knew I was being ironic. Glenn is simply patronizing those who are debating him, and I think you understand that. Why doesn't he respond to the issues we raise? He sticks with arguing the red herrings, because he doesn't really want to confront his own self-hatred.

You could, at the very least, Google "Zionism" and look at the Wiki article for a start.

Nothing in your post has any relation to the reality of modern Zionist thought (which started at latest, around the 1890's) and Zionist actions in the Middle East.

As Glenn so eloquently points out over and over, your entire conception of Israel is a fantasy, which you do not even try to reconcile with your attitudes and narratives about other world events.

Despite the awful subject-matter of the current debate, I think it presents an opportunity for each of us to reconsider our biases and assumption and, for that, Glenn is owed a debt. And especially by those who avail themselves of the opportunity to see The Other as a human being, with weaknesses and struggles, not evil incarnate just because he or she sees things differently. Matters are rarely as simple as one would like. Which doesn't mean that problems are insoluble, just that the solutions are inevitably more nuanced than the comforting simplicity of those living in a dichotomous world. In fact, whether it be the influence of the Satanic Jews of Hollywood, or whatever, I do detect some softening of Glenn's position on Israel. Well, maybe I'm imaging that last bit.

As a polite question, where exactly are you now, considering the time-zone you purport to be living in at the moment? All we can hear about what's happening in Gaza is from the Australian-accented voice of Mark Regev and from the two dyed blondes, Tzipi Livni and Avital Leibovich. Don't you have any good hair salons in Israel and perhaps you could tell the world why they have chosen to look like Irma Griese "the beast of Belsen". The Israelis have taken complete control of Gaza, even prohibiting the media of the free world from entry. The media is not even allowed on the border but has to remain several miles down the road under the surveillance of Israeli soldiers. Whatever could be the reason for this? I's obvious its not solicitude for the health and welfare of the hemmed-in journalists. Come on, Jonathan in Tallahassee, you're an eager beaver, posting frenziedly. There must be another reason.

Governor Richardson is now withdrawing from Obama's Cabinet. What can be going on? Maybe it's been discovered that he wasn't a Mesopotamian after all and didn't, as he claimed, have an ancestor who invented the plow (plough) in what is modern Iraq.

Gosh, I always thought that the idea that Jews could not live in peace and fellowship as Jews in any non-discriminatory country in the world, and must have a seperate country where they reign supreme smacks much, much more of self-hatred than anti-Zionism ever can.

Tell me, Zenwick, what is wrong with Jews that they can not live anywhere they please? And please tell me, Zenwick, if the Goyim are subject to go on an anti-semetic spree and kill us all, why does Israel tie its very existence to help from the Goyim?

I am prepared to ask that question all day until you answer it, and I hope others are too.

Zionism requires self hatred- it assumes there is something wrong with Jews. It also requires minipulating the Goyim in a way which should be beneath Jews.