You do good work Mr greenwald. :)

We agree.

Which would be true if they hadnt admitted to the crimes themselves. You do take confessionns dont you? -- druidbros

I certainly missed seeing any confessions, perhaps you could point that out in a cite?

I take exception to your vague statements about our bias and "religion".

I have tried to deal evenly with Foodle throughout this entire thread until it became obvious to me that she is sliding on her own slippery version of the truth just like Liasson did. I don't think anyone here is trying to say that all Americans want us out of Iraq damn the consequences. We aren't even trying to argue that there aren't significant numbers of Americans who do want the govt. to consider facts on the ground when leaving Iraq. We are trying to point out that Liasson fudged the truth in her statement and did what right-wing pundits have been doing for a long time -- she reduced all thought contrary to her own to some left-wing "fringe", despite very strong facts to the contrary (little facts like numerous polls showing 55-60% of Americans holding this left-wing fringe view).

A lie is a lie even if you are sloppy, stupid or a lazy reporter. As a person who commands an audience and expects to express ideas/information that should be taken seriously by listeners, get your facts straight and very carefully separate your own opinions from what polls indicate (even if you think they are misleading or inaccurate), then make it clear where you are stating your own opinions of the wisdom of what is clearly a publicly-held opinion. There is entirely too much editorializing by those in "news" media, too much personal agenda, and way too much use of the cover of "news reporting" to push personal or organizational agendas. Let's erect some fences between News (reporting) and Opinion - and while you are providing "opinion", take note of opposing views in an appropriately honest and fair manner. I have no problem with Greenwald's use of "lie" in this story.

My son-in-law just finished Officer's Training, and is scheduled to go to Iraq in the next 6 months. His wife, my daughter, just began her practice as an OB/GYN in western Wisconsin this year. They have five children, with another due in November. Personally, I want the war to be over, our occupation of Iraq to end, and ALL of the troops home as soon as possible...within 16 months certainly, but sooner if possible. I am not comfortable with the idea of my son-in-law being in harms way in Iraq so that Americans can continue to have unlimited access to oil. And I certainly don't want him to die for the lies that have fueled this fiasco by George Bush and his co-conspirators. I suspect that most Americans, whether they have loved ones in Iraq (or on the way there) or not, feel the same way...as all polls indicate.

Shooter sez:

Look folks, if you're going to insist on withdrawal from Iraq, why not withdrawal from ALL the overseas engagements, and the 700-odd bases we have. No more casualties, pay off all our debts, the world will love us, and the price of crude would drop. What's not to like?

Indeed. What's not to like? This may be shooter's sarcasm, but the reality is that this is the ideal we need to shoot for (ha!).

"[W]hat kind of Iraq does he want to leave behind" (Liasson) is not Obama's, or Bush's, or anyone's call except that of the Iraqi people. We should never have invaded, and we should withdraw immediately. And pay reparations, and beg for forgiveness. We need to get to the point where we understand that we are not automatically entitled to intervene militarily wherever and whenever we please. This is behaviour we would never tolerate in another power so how is it that we take it for granted that we can do it?

I'm fully aware that none of this will happen any time soon, and that advocating this makes me Seriously Un-Serious. (And that war is a tremendously profitable business model for some.) But morally it is the only right thing to do. So long as we give ourselves the right to intervene in the affairs of others we are doomed to relive what we are living now with respect to Iraq.

Excellent points. I agree completely. Liasson did lie, and I'm sure she will continue to do so.

Not worth the effort. You wouldnt believe it anyway.

Re: your update.

See the book "On Bullshit."

which is part of why "conditions on the ground" is just another euphemism for "going along to get along" ...

then there is that Embassy... all those indepenedent contractors and all of the "American Interests" in the form of multinational corporations including the oil industry ...

We have leave because it's the only right thing to do ... and, yes, we will be picking up the tab for reconstruction and reparations for a generation to come.

Breaking:

“Today, we are looking at the necessity of terminating the foreign presence on Iraqi lands and restoring full sovereignty,” Maliki told Arab ambassadors in blunt remarks during an official visit to Abu Dhabi, capital of the United Arab Emirates.

He apparently didn't get the memo.

Maliki has said similar things in the past, but his hold on power and his personal safety have been at the "discretion" of American power.

Do I hear helicopters on the roof? No, just mosquitos.

we should withdraw immediately. And pay reparations, and beg for forgiveness

Withdraw immediately, yes. The risk of worse repercussions than staying is actually quite low- and limited, even if it does happen. What- does anyone think that we'll have a new Communist China on our hands as a result, much less the equivalent of the Soviet Union?

"Who lost China"- what an unimportant question that always was, in terms of the danger posed to the USA. Beyond the fact that it wasn't the USA's to lose.

"Who lost Iraq?"- mutatis mutandis, the same question, and the same insights apply.

"Who lost..." is one of those "manhood" questions. The actual relevance of the consequences is unimportant. And we talk about the Arab world having masculinity hang-ups, as if it were something peculiar to them.

Reparations? Only if the country gets it's act together. We've dropped enough money over there- literally, in some cases, throwing billions out the window, a bundle of cash of cash so huge that it amounted to the largest one-time payout ever from the US Federal Reserve:

"...A separate congressional inquiry has uncovered the sums of cash airlifted into Iraq after the invasion. Desperate for money, and with no banking system to receive wire transfers, the CPA, led by Paul Bremer, received UN approval to fund reconstruction with $37 billion of seized Iraqi oil proceeds, most of it held in the US Federal Reserve in New York.

Soon, large quantities of cash began arriving in Baghdad, shipped in on C17 cargo planes. The cash arrived on pallets loaded with shrink-wrapped bundles of crisp $100 bills. The parcels, which soon became known as “bricks”, were handed out “like candy”, one Democrat congressman said.

In all, $12 billion in cash, weighing 363 tonnes, was flown into Iraq. On December 12, 2003, one single flight to Iraq contained $1.5 billion in cash, the largest single Federal Reserve payout in US history, according to Henry Waxman, the Democrat congressman who is investigated the funding.

The US has so far spent $226 billion on the Iraq war. The CPA was allocated $38 billion in US and Iraqi funds, and spent $19.7 billion of UN-administered Iraqi oil money."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article720217.ece

Enough of that.

And no "begging for an apology", either. Sounds virtuous, but it's Western liberal unrealism. That's what philandering husbands are supposed to do with their wives, but it's no behavior for a nation-state in the Arab Middle East. Culturally speaking, you might as well send them a note saying "You've conquered us." In fact, that's probably how Americans would take a gesture like that, if it were the other way around.

We don't beg; we simply pack up our soldiers and military equipment, and as much else as we can carry, and leave.