Letters to the Editor
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yes, thanks to all
for the links and documentation. They are what is most useful.
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-- Anonymust
"Bucky's snideness aside... It is not all that surprising that you hadn't heard or read about the issue of euros or dollars for oil."
You are a jerk. I am the least snide person here and went to length to say that I was not trying to be snide. I think you are letting your hatred show a bit sweetie.
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Ah, say it again, shriek it again
@Che Pasa
The Americans blithely build military bases on top of the ruins of Babylon and Nineveh. How can this be even imaginable?
No doubt they take the crumbling bricks for landing pad ballast. Of course. There's such a ready supply.
You make me weep and rage at the same time with these simple statements.
When I first read of the base over the top of Babylon my gut felt hollowed out.
Soulless. Monstrous. Criminal.
No good can come from such rank disregard for the very cradle of ALL civilization. Ugly Americans come in and piss on the ruins of Babylon and spout nonsense about the people being nothing and having no culture, etc.
Words cannot convey...
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The good questions
What Charlie Rose and the others should be asking is why did those of us against the war get it right when the others didn't?
I think their assumption is that we were all reflexively and unthinkingly antiwar - the epitomoe of the bedraggled hippy in a drug fog saying "peace, man."
There were many reasons to oppose this war and none were rooted in fashion or drugs.
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The real Gulf War
People might find this site of interest, it's one of my favorite places. I'm sure Aycharaych probably frequents it too? Here is the piece on the Gulf War.
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0212/pt_intro.html
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shooter is funny
* There is no room for conversation in your position. "War is bad because people get killed." End of discussion. What else are you going to say to fill up airtime?
perhaps we can chat about the thoughts of bizzaro world conservatives who claim to be the party of life, and claim to believe in small government and limited to no government intervention, unless it involves cutting welfare checks to Raytheon and Lockheed or using big government to intervene in other countries.
* Why would it have been better to gamble, that Saddam has no weapons, no bad intent, and is just posturing?
In order to posture, wouldn't Saddam have had to have claimed he had weapons to begin with instead of being asked to prove the negative, a popular trick with the establishment?
* If said gamble is wrong ten,hundreds, thousands, millions of American lives are in jeopardy. Why isn't that a concern?
Who's lives? Yours? How? Maybe it isn't a concern in the same way that the millions of Iraqi civilians we've bombed and killed over the past couple of decades or so are of no concern? They don't exist, they don't do bodycounts, just like the existential threats you are so fearful of don't exist, except in your paranoid reality.
* Lastly, I'd love to hear the anti-war crowd explain to the nation, why they were willing to lie down for Saddam.
Because nobody cared about what one US sponsored tin pot dictator of many in the middle east may or may not have done? But you first. Maybe you can tell us why we are willing to continue "laying down" for the House of Saud, Egypt, and the rest of our Police State Allies in the War on Terror?
The willingness to leave the country "defenseless" after a life-altering terrorist act is not a position that can be taken seriously. Ergo, no interviews.
How has bombing Iraq and inflaming Muslims helped keep us secure? Wouldn't all those troops be better off at home, securing the US? More appealing to the fearful hypothetical "what if" doomsday scenario. What a cheap trick.
But you buy into the bigoted, fearful paranoia that fuels the "they'll follow us home" garbage. OBL's plan to take over Los Angeles and San Fransisco will succeed unless you're very very afraid!
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No good can come from such rank disregard ...
"...for the very cradle of ALL civilization. Ugly Americans come in and piss on the ruins of Babylon and spout nonsense about the people being nothing and having no culture, etc."
Rush Limbaugh once said on the radio something like, "they have no culture, they have never even built a car"!
A question for you. If we ever get out of this mess in the middle east in out lifetime; how do we stop some other damn fool president from invading some poor little country to 'help them' and with 'the best of intentions'; how do we stop the next one?
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@shooter242
Let's break it down even more simple:
1) Hussein and bin Laden hated each other.
2) After bin Laden attacked us, Bush attacked bin Laden's enemy.
3) The threat from bin Laden cannot possibly be diminished by this action, in fact it wasted our resources, decreased our morale, and embittered the Arab world against us.
4) If you feel safer because of the Iraq war, there's something wrong in your brain.
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tempus I agree.
The Wash/Po had an archeological sketch of what the old buildings may have looked like?
I wished I had saved the special feature? Or, it was just a small ancient historical blip back.
The piece was impressive.
I was sad too.
Jkalos touche.
Knock head on wood.
Let's try to keep in touch.
I forgot what I was gonna say?
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@ondelettte
Here are some responses:
Ondelette: "1) The bloodbath. The anti-war crowd has very little argument against the people who assert that a sudden withdrawal will create a bloodbath..."
Dude. Look around. There's already a bloodbath in Iraq. 30 people die in a bombing here, 15 die in a bombing there, a mass grave of 120 people is found, etc. Dozens, scores or hundreds die on a daily basis. The total estimated dead runs from 700,000 to over a million. Keeping U.S. troops in Iraq is like keeping a knife in a wound to slow down the bleeding it has caused.
ondelette: "2) Diplomacy and negotiations. I mentioned quite a few months ago that the person the U.S. was going to have to negotiate with was Muktada al-Sadr. I believe that even more strongly now."
Fine. As I understand it, under Petraeus it is already a policy to talk to many insurgent/faction leaders, even the ones considered enemies. But sure, let's expand it wherever it might help, why not.
ondelette: "3) There is a nugget of truth in what Gelb said, that the primary thing is to make a decision to withdraw, not the timetable."
Hair-splitting. A decision to withdraw and how, and a timetable, are just two sides of the same "planning" coin.
ondelette: "4) The Iranian government needs to be engaged."
Agreed, though you might not want to mention anything to Israel.
ondelette: "1) A complete solution includes: Withdrawal from Iraq, Prosecution of those responsible for the invasion, reparations, negotiating new alliances and diplomatic relations, restructuring our foreign policy to emphasize peaceful diplomacy over military might, rehabilitation of the refugees, and humanitarian aid and reconstruction."
I can agree with that.
ondelette: "2) The way around the bloodbath is to immediately recognize and begin negotiations with Muktada al-Sadr, and begin by asking him and his people to generate their plan for post-America Iraq, and have neutral but informed parties look at it and figure out how it can be expanded to be inclusive and practical. Then help whoever ends up in the mix to implement it."
This is going to take a long time. It's going to be like a 10-year divorce process after a 5-year marriage.
ondelette: "3) As Angelina Jolie commented on WaPo a couple of weeks ago, we have a responsibility to deal with the human tragedy we have caused and no plan that has us washing our hands and walking away is moral, just, or even viable."
I am all for making reparations and so on, but just imagine how screwed the U.S. is going to be in terms of its Middle East influence after withdrawing from Iraq. Our dollar is already weak, how are we going to afford paying to clean up our mess in Iraq? We're totally screwed. I agree with your statement though.
ondelette: "4) Immediate negotiations must begin with Iran without preconditions on either side, with the goal of regional stabilization and with the hope of improved relations leading to full diplomatic relations as soon as possible."
It would help immensely if Iran had a functioning democracy and the pro-modern majority elected somebody better than Ahmadinejad.
ondelette: "5) Our foreign policy needs to be dissected and rebuilt and restructured from top to bottom."
Don't expect this without a fight. The countries we prop up now are like crack addicts and they will not suffer withdrawal symptoms gladly.
ondelette: "6) Those responsible for this fiasco, together with all those who have participated in torture and inhumane treatment, from the President down to the interrogators, need to be arrested, and remanded to The Hague for international tribunal. What we expect of others who transgress, we should expect of ourselves."
Good luck. I agree though. I would add to that list all the war profiteers, from Halliburton to Blackwater to SAIC, to name but a few. Not to mention the revolving door of Pentagon employees turned military-industrial lobbyists turned Pentagon employees with stock options.