Not my place? I am not an allowed an opinion by the almighty Josh? He of many other blatantly sexist posts?

are you confusing different Joshes?

and why do you hate women so much? seriously?

god you're a misogynist. disgusting

Seriously peoples...there have been a lot of great responses here deserving of discusion in my opinion, but the Battle Against Tina marginalizes all of them. Its just one person, you know, and an intractable argument.

....um, why doesn't it? Because she dresses nicely? Because money magically changes denigration into something else?

Or because you all have some silly fantasies about high-end hookers?

that was some bad blockquoting

She's dishing it out and others are dishing it back.

People that "tire and slave" in fast food restaurants for a paycheck is comparable to women selling themselves for sex? Really?? Because I always thought that while someone could separate themselves from the burgers they flip, the GAP clothes they sew or the coffee they pick, it would be absolutely impossible for a prostitute to detach her self-worth from her profession. And comments like "if it was a diamond ring, no one would be saying anything" only reinforces the idea that compensation in ANY form (btw, the idea that women are owed for the sex they bring to a relationship is an entirely different frustrating topic) COMPLETELY erases all the complex issues that sex involves. Say what you will- it's not an easy commodity that you capitalists want it to be.

Male sex workers can scew anyone because men are by nature vile and nasty beasts who only want sex and aren't penetrated...oh wait...what I mean to say is since men are always horny, the feelings of a male sex worker are of no consequence. Even when they are "forced" to have sex with vile and disgusting men (or women.)

Just little levity...nobody hurt me please.

All oomex needs to do now is post a video on Youtube and I'll be Britney Spears.

Leave Tina alooooooooone.....

Thanks, oomex.

I wish they'd find something else to do, too.

Her points are ridiculous, why address them? Why do so many of the pages in these two Spitzer pieces have her name all over them?

“And for the person who brought up Japan--Japan is one of the most ragingly sexist countries on earth--women are treated like dirt there.”

That person was me and how much time have you spent in Japan or studying Japanese culture? You assume that because Japan is by your definition a sexist country that the Japanese have no right to define marriage or sex in any way except that the one that confines itself to your definition.

Lets look at sex. Why is it that Japanese public baths can have all ages of people and both genders be completely nude together and no sex is involved? Because the Japanese only go to a public bath to be cleansed and refreshed. Yet if that is done in America, it has to be done at nudist colonies and anywhere else it is morally wrong and sometimes illegal. Most Japanese men and women can find paid sex outside of marriage and it will in no way affect the marriage. The Japanese can see sex as simply a pleasure event and not related to whether love in a marriage exists or not.

The wife almost always totally controls the family including the money and the husband’s role is only wage earner. The husband and wife may see very little of each other and most wives will tell you they like it that way. The marriage often is more of a business partnership than a love relationship.

Now Tina and probably you are going to say that Japanese women are being psychologically damaged because their culture doesn’t conform to yours. That is what I, Glenn and many others are objecting to. It is not up to you to tell someone else they are wrong or are being oppressed when the facts and their beliefs say otherwise. Your confining morality is harming others and that is not fair or right.

I am not saying that you don't have a right to your views. I am saying that I have a right to mine and the fact that you can’t respect mine because they don’t agree with yours, is extremely frustrating, especially when you can’t recognize you are doing it.

Wouldn't they be better off if they could unionize orsomething? Do hookers in Nevada brothels have health insurance?

Hey, I don't patronize hookers for lots of reasons. I tend to agree w/ a number of the commenters who are uncomfortable w/ the interpersonal dynamic of it, and the fact that it may be degrading in a lot of cases.

I just don't see how making it illegal helps. At all.

I would posit that sex and labor as commodities are both fraught issues that need to be addressed intelligently, with an understanding that they are two different things.

I'm not defending you. My point is that there are other issues to be discussed on the Spitzer topic. This is not a case conducive to bring up the social costs of prostitution or whether it should illegal--high price call girls are really outside of any of that discourse. If Spitzer had been caught with a sex slave from a third world country or a street prostitute, or drug addicted street prostitute, your arguments would be worth examining.

Nate K. is an idiot.

I just wanted to share that.

Mona you are obviously a self-hating woman if you think women prostituting themselves isn't the worst thing in the world. You've internalized the male-power structure and no longer can see prostitution for what it is. Thank God we have people here like Tina to show us the way. You better let her educate you on how woman are supposed to think.

Sorry if I misunderstood, but when you say:

Until you have had sex with a man you find offensive or vile, but you must go on, you cannot appreciate this fact. You just can't.

This is an admonition to those of us who haven't had this experience to refrain from projecting our guesses as to what it might feel like. Sound advice. But isn't the implication just that you have had this experience and are therefore not projecting? Because if you also haven't had this experience why are your projections more valid than others', and why admonish others to avoid doing something that you yourself are doing if you haven't actually experienced this yourself?

Sorry if I misunderstood.

When abortion opponents tell women they are doing something inherently immoral when they choose to have an abortion, the feminist (and I believe, correct) answer is usually to say something along the lines of: keep your morals out of my womb.

What is different about claiming prostitution is inherently immoral? What if a woman (or man) says they have no problem with the particular guy/gal involved, (they don't see them as vile or reprehensible--or even further, they say they find the prospective client attracive) and don't have any objections to the act that is being asked, are perfectly happy with the money they're being offered, etc. Is it your contention that this is an inherently immoral use of his/her body? Would you say that in the case of prostitution a woman has no say over the use of her own body because what she is wanting to do with her body is inherently immoral?

If so, what's the difference between those who say abortion is immoral and not a proper choice for the use of a woman's body, and those who say the same of prostitution?

Why isn't this another case of "keep your morals out of my womb?"

It might be the case that to allow even one woman to rent/sell her body will necessarily lead to abuse of the practice, so we need to keep it illegal. This is arguable on its own. I don't think it's an argument you would win, but there is one to be made. But that is different from claiming prostitution is inherently immoral. Much or the real world activity surrounding prostitution is morally reprehensible, and those guilty of forcing others to do anything they don't want to deserve whatever the law allows to be done to them. But even if we stamp out all the negative activity surrounding prostitution, there will still be cases where women (and men)are offered money to perform sexual acts, and even smart, strong, mentally and emotionally healthy women (and men) will think it's worth it to engage in such activity. Are these women/men morally inferior to you for thinking it's Ok to do that? Do you have a right to do what anti-abortion folks want to do, and tell women/men what they are and are not allowed to do with their own bodies?