Letters to the Editor
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What sort of man has sex with a hooker and doesn't want to wear a condom?
My Lord, I find this the most disturbing thing about the whole encounter. I mean, Spitzer, are you insane? I had a friend who was a call girl (1,000-variety) and she went on a job in the Hollywood Hills with some big hot shot producer, and the guy wouldn't put a condom on, and he gave her herpes. It got her out of the business for awhile, but then she was back to "escorting" after a few months. Which should be a warning to all of you who might use prostitutes! I don't care how expensive they are, they can still have diseases!
(I am in no way using her experience to inform my feelings on prostitution.)
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One woman's opinion
I have no use whatsoever for men who screw prostitutes.
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Who cares about Elliot Spitzer's career?
Who cares about Elliot Spitzer's career? He chose to betray his wife and three daughters. They have been hurt in a way you cannot understand unless you have lived through it. This is not a victimless crime as so many people want so desperately to believe. Mrs. Spitzer and the Spitzer daughters have been shattered in a way that pales in comparison to anyone Spitzer prosecuted during his career. I bet Glenn Greenwald would have a different opinion if his wife or significant other engaged in private, consensual sex with someone else. Where have all the real men gone?
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@stackey-dackey
Actually it's you that sounds condescending. I don't see what you are saying about tina, her arguments seemed well phrased and not condescending at all, at least to me. Maybe you can direct me to the offending post so I can understand what you are saying. But, again it's you who seems full of scorn and anger for those who disagree with you, as it seems to me like you are the one scolding tina for disagreeing with you.
Second about the exploitation thing, read my long post (second to last post I made here) and the posts by others who don't agree with Glen that prostitution is a victimless trade.
If that doesn't tell you anything I suggest you read Bob Herbert's columns as well. (There's a poster who links to both those columns) But for efficiency sake, I'll repost them:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/27/opinion/27herbert.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/19/opinion/19herbert.html
Try to convince the 50,000 victims of trafficking that they are not being exploited. You are insane to argue otherwise. Women being bought and sold like commodities is most definitely exploitative. The absence to give consent, or the inability to say "no" either from force or coercion is not the same as free willed consent. Remember that.
And, L.W.C. or whatever your initials are, you seem equally misinformed of feminist theory. Feminists mostly agree that prostitution is used to oppress women, not to empower them. I don't know where you got this idea from, obviously you didn't talk to any real feminists or look up any feminist theory. Can you direct me to the website, or person whom you got this idea from, (if it wasn't just from personal anecdotal evidence)
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Are the Republicans illegally wiretapping Democrats?
Are the Republicans wiretapping Democrats? Is this why the Bushies fight so hard to keep telephone companies out of court? Thom asks if Republicans were wiretapping Sen. Kennedy. Remember they were caught hacking Kennedy's emails and found out Democratic strategies in congress. So I ask, was Spitzer selected as a Democrat for wiretapping? Who else? Obama? Clinton? Nixon did it and when caught was threatened with certain impeachment and the FISA bill was the result. Why is Bush fighting so hard to keep his wiretapping secret from FISA court oversight? Why aren't Dems in congress worried that their phones are being tapped and their conversations shared with the Republican party?
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ny times spins spitzer scandal as "non-partisan"
Glenn,
Look at how this piece is summarized on the Times's front page.
Politics, and Scandal, as Usual
By N. R. KLEINFIELD 11:38 AM ET
Why do politicians at all levels keep starring in this familiar and
non-partisan soap opera rerun?
The article contextualizes Spitzer with allusions to Shakespeare and
evolutionary biology. It mentions scandals from both parties, but that
hardly means any one of them was "non-partisan" if looked at in actual
historical, political context. Very blatant white-washing here.
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Interesting letters on this
"...There's an old saying about lead, follow or get out of the way.. I'll choose none of the above.. If I think the leaders and followers are headed in the wrong direction I have no problem at all putting my ass right in their way.
I'm stubborn, opinionated, self righteous, arrogant and a jerk. And those are my good qualities."
__________________________________________________________
Gotta like that.
Glenn, thanks for the post. It's certainly got a few moralistic folks' knickers in a twist.
Spitzer still has to deal with his family, first and foremost. And his Harvard trained attorney wife can (and probably should) chew him up and spit him out. And this sting does smell, worse than Siegelman's ordeal and trial did. Please, let someone go after the ones who ordered the electronic and/or financial surveillance of the governor. This setup reeks of Rove.
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Not all prostitution is between "consenting" adults.
I agree that what happens between consenting adults, as long as it doesn't violate the civil liberties of others, should be nobody's business beyond those involved, especially the government's. And that there is an arbitrary and irreconcilable double standard and no real distinction between prostitution and pornography.
Man pays consenting woman (or man) to have sex = prostitution.
Man pays consenting woman (or man) to have sex, videotapes the act and sells the tape = pornography.
And here's another one:
Man pays for dinner, alcohol, transportation and a movie = a date.
Man gives woman the cash instead = prostitution.
But non-consensual, coerced prostitution does exist, as does, I'm sure, non-consensual, coerced pornography, and that, of course, should be illegal.
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Hypocrisy Ain't the Worst Crime
I am perturbed that people go nuts over the hypocrite, as if hypocrisy is the worst sin in the known universe. Hypocrisy means you teach one thing and do another. I think we are all guilty of that. One of the universal experiences of parenthood is teaching your children to live to a higher standard than you ever did.
I am not from New York and can't say how good a governor he is, but if he is competent why throw him out over such foolishness? Bad governors are a dime a dozen. Good ones are hard to come by. If he was a good governor before he might be a better one now, humbled as he now is.
Now, Craig and Vitter are different. They didn't simply have sex with prostitutes, they lied about it to the press. Lying is a different thing, but Spitzer did not lie, nor did he pull a Clintonesque or Craigeque public prevarication. That makes a difference.
I say let him serve out his term. The voters can decide on his future come re-election time.