That Senators and Congresscritters were deluged with mail from constituents who were dead set against the invasion.

They voted for it anyway.

I'll be surprised if it turns out all that differently this time.

Two points:

1) Who would be in a better position to have the dirt on various members of Congress that those who handle their communications?

2) The Anthrax mailer has yet to be found and Congress seems not to care one whit about a direct and deadly threat against two of its senior members.

Dodd is emerging as the candidate with real leadership ability. He may be the proverbial dark horse we need to get this country back on the right track.

It is refreshing to see some of the democrats actually doing something about the destruction of Constituional rights that has occurred under the Bush administration. The fact that the rule of law no longer seems to apply to those in power makes it difficult to understand why it should apply to anyone at all. Evidence suggests that with enough money, one can simply buy off the politicians, and have no consequences to criminal activity.

One wonders when sufficient pressure will be brought to bear on Nancy Pelosi, to force her to put impeachment 'on the table'. Unless Bush and Cheney, amongst others, are impeached, this will give cart blanche to their successors to continue to flout and rewrite laws according to their whims.

For there to be any meaningful return to the rule of law, impeachment must take place, or the Republic is dead.

If Pelosi won't put impeachment on the table, are there any House members who could be the "go to guy" just like Dodd has been in the Senate?

What other options can be put on the table if we can't get impeachment? Indictments? Arrests? Serious investigations?

Glenn, do you think it makes any difference that Obama/others refer explicitly to retroactive immunity? Grnated , "prospective" immunity would not seemingly torpedo the active lawsuits, BUT, am I missing something? Paranoid, maybe?

I'm delighted, albeit a little surprised, at how this issue has caught on. Good work Glenn, FDL, and most of all Senator Dodd.

Glenn, do you think it makes any difference that Obama/others refer explicitly to retroactive immunity? Grnated , "prospective" immunity would not seemingly torpedo the active lawsuits, BUT, am I missing something? Paranoid, maybe?

Prospective immunity is already a clause enacted in the horrific August FISA bill -- providing that telecoms can't be sued as long as they get the certifications required by law that what they are doing is legal.

To be fair, that was already in the original FISA bill -- the 1978 law, that said that if telecoms had a certification from the AG that the order to turn over access doesn't require a warrant, then they would be immunized. For reasons still unclear (Aschcroft didn't know the whole time, he refused to give it, htey are worried about the 2-week period when DOJ refused to certify?), they apparently didn't get the certifications needed before.

Yes, prospective immunity is bad. But retroactive immunity is much, much worse. And there are a lot of other bad parts to this FISA bill than just retroactive immunity. But that's hard enough to stop, and -- as unfortunate as it is - these types of campaigns require an extreme focus and narrow message if they have any hope of succeeding.

To me, defeating retroactive immunity at least keeps alive the various avenues for (a) having a ruling that the NSA spying programs broke the law, (b) investigating what happened here, and (c) providing accountability for the lawbreakers. It's the thread that can cause the whole thing to unravel. That's why I'm focusing on this.

At Chris Dodd's website, they have put up a very useful table with the members of the Senate Judiciary Committee and their current position on the inclusion of retroactive immunity. By clicking on a link, you are then given an individual Senator's phone number and a web form to fill in reporting on your call to the office. Reports are starting to come in, and so far only John Kyl has said he will vote for immunity while Joe Biden and Russ Feingold have announced they will vote against it. I didn't have time to call them all, but was told that Senators Schumer, Kennedy, Feinstein and Specter have not yet announced their decisions. Specter's office told me they do not announce positions prior to committee votes. Kennedy's office reminded me that the Senator has been out of the office due to health issues. We need eight more votes to strip retroactive immunity from the bill as it leaves the committee.

Link: http://chrisdodd.com/immunity

There is slmost nothing in the MSM on this issue. Obviously the Telecoms want it to blow over. The amount of outrage and the action which followed is completely because of the efforts of bloggers like Glenn. This blog, and a few other really helped to focus the actions of the concerned public, so that the individual actions occured nearly simultaneously. This type of rapid, highly focused response was the two-by-four between the eyes of the campaign staffs. And I think it is also significant that the shortest answer Joe Biden ever gave to a question is the most memorable contribution of his ling career as a public servant.

Now we just have to make it official.

He's got my vote in the primary.

... make that Chris "Dodd", obviously.

If the FISA bill currently begin debated in Congress should pass with no provisions for retroactive immunity for telecommunications companies, this will have been achieved, in no small part, due to the efforts of Glenn Greenwald. I am sure I speak for many, Mr. Greenwald, when I say thank you for all you do - it is columns/blogs like yours that give me hope that democracy isn't completely dead in this country.

Retroactive immunity will be stripped from the Senate bill; it will not be in the House bill.

Retroactive immunity will be restored in the Conference bill, which no one will notice because no one reads bills, the Conference bill will pass overwhelmingly, will get rushed to the White House, Bush will sign it amid much pomp and circumstance.

The lawsuits against the telecoms will be quashed one by one and in batches.

We will have been had. "Process."

And of course there will be many, many vows to Fix This. But nothing will be done. The fait as it were will be accompli.

While this is not the only scenario possible, it is the one most likely given the utter cravenness of our Elected Representatives in Congress Assembled. They have pulled this very shit before.

In this case, it is really, really important to establish Immunity for the lawlessness of the past. It's not just the telecoms who would be forgiven after all; it's also hundreds or thousands of Government employees. It's the entire Bushevik hierarchy as well, both serving and dismissed.

Does anybody really think they will all of a sudden yield to the Rule Of Law?

I don't.