Letters to the Editor
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Shooter Tries Again
"Or not. So far the only Supremes ruling seems to be Hamdi specifying Habeas Corpus for citizens no matter the designation. In addition is this June ruling by the 4th circuit that a resident alien is entitled to Habeas as well. That would certainly incluse citizens. If you have something that disproves that, we should see it. Otherwise you're just fear-mongering."
You still haven't answered the question I posed the last time you ran this lame wheeze past us.
What will you do, Shooter, if some President (or his designate) declares you to be an unlawful enemy combatant and locks you up in some hole in Wingnutistan.
Oh? He can't do that since you're a citizen?
Prove it. Just don't think you can get on the horn and call a lawyer. You won't have the right to a lawyer either. Prove you're a citizen.
Whatchagonna do, Shooter? Thanks to our intrepid Congress, the President has the law on his side now. He can lock you up and unless you can prove you're a citizen, you're fucked and you'll have no recourse in the courts.
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By The Way, Shooter -
Since when does our Constitution apply only to citizens and legal aliens?
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@Retired Military Patriot
"Chances are many of your friends Chris are not Joe Public types. We won’t get much traction on this issue without finding a way to reach the Joes and Janes."
I guess I am saying that each of taps into opportunities that present themselves to us. For 35 years I taught at both the high school and university levels, and it was in those places that I had my chance to influence issues like this. As both an English and a history teacher, I attempted to redirect students to texts (a wide variety of them) to either support or refute their own arguments. I posed series of questions rather than made statements because I had come to understand that this method worked better than using metaphoric hammers, darts, or nuclear weapons (although no mushroom clouds appeared in the ether above my classrooms).
My weapon of choice is the generational sword, and if recent polls tracking the political preferences of those under 30 are accurate, then my fractional toil dissecting Shakespeare's Julius Caesar, MacBeth, and Hamlet may have nudged some of them in the proper direction.
By the way, I enjoy your posts and respect your expertise. Keep it up. To each his own strength.
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re: Shooter Tries Again
Jebbie --You still haven't answered the question I posed the last time you ran this lame wheeze past us. What will you do, Shooter, if some President (or his designate) declares you to be an unlawful enemy combatant and locks you up in some hole in Wingnutistan. Oh? He can't do that since you're a citizen?
Prove it. Just don't think you can get on the horn and call a lawyer. You won't have the right to a lawyer either. Prove you're a citizen. Whatchagonna do, Shooter? Thanks to our intrepid Congress, the President has the law on his side now. He can lock you up and unless you can prove you're a citizen, you're fucked and you'll have no recourse in the courts.
I just gave you a court case that says even resident aliens get Habeas. And the following is an expansion on the requirement for citizens to get Habeas no matter what the designation. Now, like I said to the other guy, if you have something that says citizens and resident aliens are NOT entitled to habeas (and due process) let's see it. Apparently all the folks being held currently have access to a lawyer. Do you have evidence otherwise? I'm open to information about this because the issue is far from settled, but "because I say so" is not a valid argument.
He (Hamdi) was a party to a Supreme Court decision Hamdi v. Rumsfeld which issued a decision on June 28, 2004, repudiating the U.S. government's unilateral assertion of executive authority to suspend the constitutional protections of individual liberty of a U.S. citizen. The Court recognized the power of the government to detain unlawful combatants, but ruled that detainees must have the ability to challenge their detention before an impartial judge. Though no single opinion of the Court commanded a majority, eight of the nine justices of the Court agreed that the Executive Branch does not have the power to hold indefinitely a U.S. citizen without basic due process protections enforceable through judicial review.
Since when does our Constitution apply only to citizens and legal aliens?
As opposed to illegal aliens, or people in another country? If an illegal commits a crime here he's in the system and as far as I know gets all the same benefits citizens do. Otherwise deport them home. Are you saying that citizens of East Timor are entitled to our laws in their country? What are you asking?
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A Bad Stretch
GG:
Imprisoning a U.S. citizen, on U.S. soil, with no charges of any kind, and then keeping him for years completely incommunicado, is just one of those lines which many people believed would never be crossed in America.
I'm certainly one of those people. My only hope for us is that my great-great grandchildren will be reading about all of this as a sad, sorry, unfortunate chapter in our nation's history.
Have a wonderful vacation.
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Looking forward to working with you shooter
As soon as the Dem POTUS takes office in January 2009 shooter will be right here with us railing against warrantless and illegal govt spying, 'wag the dog' efforts that divert resources away from the real GWOT, and unconstitutional imprisonment of citizens. Torture of even the most dangerous terrorist suspects will become war crimes when they occur under a Dem POTUS, and the money we spend in Iraq will suddenly become money wasted by an inept admin that is breaking America's armed forces with it's incompetence. Hopefully when the dittoheads join in we'll finally get out of Iraq, get our govt back on track, working transparently and according to the laws of the land. At least until another one of their loyal cult leaders manages to steal another election. Then it'll be back to monarchic powers, total secrecy, and a govt that runs on the whims of one man instead of laws.
Too bad shooter's values only kick in when Dems are running the show, but at least that means we'll have him on our side for many years to come.