Can we please, just for one, friggin', god-d*** day, stop trying to pull this entire thing here into your turdish, self-obsessive, and completely non-germane to the topic pro- and anti-libertarian debate???

Thank you, and let me second that. The vitriol spewed by certain anti-libertarian obsessives -- and some of their "fact" claims -- are easily countered, but I would like it noted that I've been behaving myself. And, I will continue to substantively ignore the compulsive, never-ending baiting. It, and the endless arguments that have in the past constantly then ensued, do no credit to the comments section here.

As ever, my respectful (for the blog) silence out not be deemed acquiescence to any of the obsessives' spewings. They ought to STOP.

Ben Franklin said, "God works wonders now and then; behold a lawyer, a honest man."

-a learned blockhead is a greater blockhead than an ignorant one.

I say and B.F's (beans and franks) toots would agree, 'a neocon will make 10,000 ways that won't work and he will try one more? yes!

-either write things wort reading or do things worth writing.

-god had incredible wisdom in that she gave man beer (not bears to haul trash) and that beer proves god wants men to be happy.

-we are all born ignorant. some people work hard and being stupid.

-sluggard, waste not your life or 'waste-away' (kill) others. In the grave we will be sleeping enough.

-a little good tit-bit of a good neighbor with a anti-American attitude can be found in Nova Scotch? The want to kill Cain goes back to when Cain was able to murder Abel. I never "boo" at a hockey game. I am amazed that the critter Puck plays so many tricks on me and you.

*Anonymous: It is sad that America has abrogated so much and sold freedom for a nasty filthy buck. We allowed the little naked baby buddha to be thrown out with the dish water? I tire of old cliches like "no throw the baby jesus out with the bath water."

-wash each other's soft baby skin behind with pure Aqua and use a soft ball of cotton."

-I also tire when poor 'ole LWM is told every day by a few libertarians to scrub with a Brillo-pad his foul odor arm pits.

-make sheep.

-wolves eat.

-Now I have a sheep and a cow and a little baby lamb. Pleeeeeeeeze bid me a good day with a soft teat filled with goat milk?

-my favorite scripture verse for today is: Mary M. had a little lamb.

-bless jesus

-no kill him

-no eat pork chops!

Well, not really.

I've been studying the effects of the surge in detail for over two months now, and I have to say that casting stones at the messengers is a failing tactic for debating the appropriatness of this strategy.

The military portion of the surge is working. Brilliantly. Why we shouldn't all be, if not happy, at least relieved that this is the case is beyond me. Certainly, in war nothing is certain. The situation on the ground can and will change, because the folks we're fighting are not stupid. However, at long last, it would appear that we are not stupid either. And, our morale is up while their morale is down.

Before the people who are totally anti Iraq war start, no, the surge does not mean that the war was the right option. It does not mean Bush and Cheney are great people. It does not mean that the military is NOT trying to get a 'message' out. You may all remain comfortable that the anger and bitterness you harbor about all these things can be maintained as long as you wish.

On the other hand, we still have the Iraq war going on. The next phase, after the security situation improves, will be to determine whether or not the country can get it's political house in order.

I doubt that you'll find anyone who would disagree with you that if there isn't a political reconciliation by next year, we should accept our losses and go home.

Hopefully that doesn't mean that people wish this to come true.

"do no credit to the comments section here"

If folks like us want to be considered as (I use this term cautiously) "serious" about subjects initiated on this blog, it behoves us to put extraneous squabbles aside and at least try to stay on topic. There are folks who come here to be educated politically and if the major posters here can't stay on topic, those folks are going to go elsewhere and the education they receive might not be what us best for us and our country.

We have enough real trolls coming in here without mucking the place up ourselves.

Here's a picture of today's NYTIMES front page.

http://nytimes.com/indexes/2007/08/04/pageone/scan

In the picture you, might notice a teeny tiny item, below the fold :

              _____________

    Wiretapping Measure Gains
    A strong push by the White House
to broaden its wiretapping authority
appeared on the verge of victory af-
ter the Senate approved a measure
to provide more latitude. Page A8.
__________________________

http://nytimes.com/2007/08/04/washington/04nsa.html

PAGE A8 The New York Times NATIONAL Saturday, August 4, 2007

Broader Spying Authority
Advances in Congress

        By Eric Lichtblau
        and Mark Mazzetti

    WASHINGTON, Aug. 3 — A furious push by the White House to broaden its wiretapping authority appeared on the verge of victory on Friday night after the Senate approved a measure that would temporarily give the administration more latitude to eavesdrop without court warrants on foreign communications that it suspects may be tied to terrorism.

The House is expected to take up the White House-backed measure on Saturday morning before going into its summer recess.

Democratic leaders acknowledged that the bill would probably pass.

Democrats in both the House and the Senate failed to pass competing measures on Friday that would have included tougher judicial checks and oversight on the eavesdropping powers.

The White House and Congressional Republicans hailed the Senate vote as critical to plugging what they saw as dangerous gaps in the intelligence agencies’ ability to detect terrorist threats.

“I can sleep a little safer tonight,” Senator Christopher S. Bond, the Missouri Republican who co-sponsored the measure, declared after the Senate vote.

The measure approved by the Senate expires in six months and would have to be re-authorized. The White House’s grudging agreement to make it temporary helped to attract the votes of some moderate Democrats who said they thought it was important for Congress to approve some version of the wiretapping bill before its recess.

The White House and Republican leaders pressed the point throughout the day that a vote against the measure would put the nation at greater risk of attack.

Some Democrats and civil rights advocates accused the Senate of capitulating to White House demands by broadening the ability to eavesdrop without warrants on communications that are primarily “foreign” in nature, even if they may touch on Americans’ phone calls and e-mail.

The measure “goes far, far beyond” the National Security Agency program that the president secretly approved after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, said Senator Russ Feingold, Democrat of Wisconsin.

- - The New York Times, Saturday, August 4, 2007

If you believe that this measure is "temporary" and that there's any chance that the provisional authority granted to the White House will be revoked in six months, I've got a bridge in Minnesota to sell you.