That was a right wing troll, you stupid fuck! You haven't read these Israeli posts very often have you? They show up all the time!

The Lebanon disaster (LWII) was the result of the democritization of Israel at a time of imminent danger. Israel began to believe its own propaganda. Israel forgot that it will lose any war of attrition. It began to believe that Middle East politics had come out of the sixth century into a new socialistic prosperity. It was not only blind, it was deaf. It did not hear the sounds of ancient tribes who cared nothing for the lives of Palestinians.

Israel was civilized. It was a democracy. It forgot that no nation is self sufficient. Its security required equality in international relations, something it would never gain without military supremacy and the willingness to use it.

Western dependency left the leadership weak and ineffectual. They committed the nation to a war of contrition, an extention of the guilt felt by the humiliation of the holocaust. This was a sense of remorse for the position of Palestinian refugees, a fatal error following the war for existence. The Arab League and its later constituancies had only one goal, the elimination of a Jewish State at any cost.

It would be realistic to begin removing land from the control of hostile forces. If one hectare of land had been taken for each injured and ten hectares for each dead Israeli there would not be a problem in Gaza. If a trench was dug through the northern and southern borders of Gaza to the sea, there would be no problem with Gaza. If negotiations were between Jordan and Israel for the division of Transjordan, there would be no Palestinian refugee problem.

Here is what you have said yesterday -

#

Israel is a cancer on the world

And you cut a cancer out for the greater good.

--Anonymous

Permalink Monday, February 11, 2008 07:40 AM

What are you saying now, that it's not you?

I didn't hear anyone here say anything about Jews being killed. Where'd you get that come from, dude?

It seems like a bad soap on reruns:

Salon publishes something, anything, that comes even close to mentioning Israel, and voila - all the "Liberals", "American Patriots" and "Logical" people of the world are dumping all the nonsense, non-fact, shear lies, and whatever else they have heard on Al Jazeera.

Joseph Goebbels would have had a big smile of his face - oh, but you know that already - didn't he personally give you all of his "art" to be used in your propaganda since the 1930's?

Hey - there is a new Hamas TV channel now - are you getting that? Love the kid shows.

Funny it never mentions the 5,000 rockets they shoot on Israel every day for the last 5 years.

How's that for harassment? For collective punishment? Even after the withdrawal from Gaza?

These rockets can kill, and were launched in order to kill, unlike the shortage of electricity which may make you cold and hungry for the night. Yes, I know you're going to give examples of how that shortage has made children sick, old people die, etc, etc. but let's get real here - what else can Israel do? - "Talk to Hamas" they say.

Are you deaf, blind and mute? haven't you heard when is Hamas going to stop that?

Let me remind you - when Israel stops to exist, as in all the Jews there are dead.

I apologize, that's exactly what you said. Sorry.

I read a recent statistic that over 4 years 18 Israelis have died in rocket attacks from Gaza.

Of course these 18 deaths were spoken about as a near Armageddon that comes close to destroying a nation.

Endless tales are told and retold to make it seem like this # is an absolute outrage against humanity, a sign Israel is about to collapse from unceasing terrorist pressure.

It's told over and over and never questioned now in order to ensure the climate of fear is permanent, to ensure the paranoia it inspires is so great that Israelis will not question or doubt the wisdom of doing unthinkable things to their neighbors with the justification that Israel cannot stop until NOT ONE ISRAELI DIES FROM TERRORISM.

Such statements are the stuff of absolute insanity that will destroy Israel from within.

NO NATION ON EARTH HAS EVER EXPERIENCED ABSOLUTE SECURITY ON THE LEVEL THAT ISRAEL NOW SAYS IS THE MINIMUM STANDARD.

Terrorism's main goal is to instill fear and paranoia in the public. The only way to prevent this victory is to NOT GIVE IN, but alas Ariel Sharon used fear like our own Generalissimo Bush did post 9/11.

Sharon was more than happy to let the Terrorists win on this point in order to turn Israeli society into what it is now, a society in which all security issues are determined by paranoid fear of impending doom.

Israel in allowing this of herself gave terrorists a key victory, that they truly do not deserve, at least NOT BASED ON THE STATISTICS, and how they compare to other nations experiencing similar situations.

"Death is death." How you die is not that important as long as the overwhelming majority are not due to war - life is good. Yet because Israel treats each rarer and rarer terrorism related death as equal to 1000 normal deaths,

even a single one in many months instills panic and almost guarantees collective punishment of over a million in order to get back at what easily could be a rogue group within Hamas.

Hamas may claim credit, but really does it matter if they did or did not. Israel in her paranoia would blame Hamas anyway.

Claiming credit makes Hamas seem far more powerful than it is or ever will be. And honestly why would they not take yet another opportunity to stoke Israel's fear and paranoia.

Israel exists in a tinderbox.

To believe or accept the seeming current belief, that Israel cannot relax until NOT one Israeli dies from a terrorist act is to basically accept defeat en toto, for by declaring an unreachable goal as the only sign of victory,

Israel makes it impossible to win.

In truth 18 dead in 4 years is about the best sign Israel has won on every level in their conflict against Hamas, especially when you consider the thousands on the other side that die indirectly from Israeli actions (regardless of wrong or right or whose side you might be on.)

Afganis would thank G-d if they only had a proportional amount dead annually from the Taliban.

Any nation on Earth in the midst of any sort of military or guerrilla conflict would have long ago declared total victory if the # of dead over 4 years was merely 18 people. But Not Israel.

Europe went through a spate of terrorism from home grown terrorist groups that resulted in many times more people being killed, yet somehow Germany, Italy avoided devolving into states of paranoid delusion as Israel has.

If Israel is to survive beyond a couple of decades, it needs to step back, calm down and understand that deaths like these are the norm IN EVERY NATION IN THE REGION.

Egypt has it's Muslim Brotherhood. Syria, Jordan have their extremists as does Lebanon.

Any of those countries would JUST LOVE to have so few of their people killed by terrorist violence over 4 years. Often they have more people killed in a single attack!

We don't hear about their terrorist violence, because it's Arab on Arab.

Those deaths, the ones Israel's neighbors suffer from their own home grown terrorist elements and which are totally UNrelated to the Israeli/Arab conflict are extremely important benchmarks for anyone interesting in trying to understand what is the norm for nations in the region.

In Israel's case, their #s are the lowest of Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Turkey and Lebanon.

If they weren't so endlessly lost in their own paranoid fear, Israelis might collectively realize THEY HAVE WON THE WAR.

The ongoing low level terrorism is NOT a sign of anything other than the character of the region. All nations there suffer from it (look at Turkey!!!)

It makes me wonder whether anyone would notice if if Israel somehow did gain the "perfect victory"

Fear and Paranoia are eating away at Israelis hearts and souls.

Those two are what is responsible for what you see there.

Jewish people who want to save Israel must stop enabling such dysfunctional reactions to the current state of affairs.

Realism and honesty MUST BE FORCED into the equation.

If a way can be found to get through the thick dark cloud of paranoid fear and help Israel to understand that she now has the ABSOLUTE BEST SITUATION THAT CAN BE HAD ANYWHERE IN ANY MIDDLE EASTERN NATION in terms of deaths from terrorism, in terms of economic success, in terms of civil rights and so on. That IS VICTORY, unless you demand a perfect victory with a perfect peace where no one ever dies again, and your neighbors promise to love you.

If Jewish people would work to make Israel see its "fortunes" and value them appropriately, rather than just focusing on the NOW RELATIVELY RARE death from terrorism, then the end of all Israel/Arab conflict would soon follow.