Letters to the Editor
-
Human Nature
"Whenever I post a video of a female technologist there invariably are snide remarks about body parts and other things that simply wouldn't happen if the interviewee were a man."
Not to excuse vile behavior, but this is a result of the differences between men and women. Women don't make those comments, partly because there is not much on a man's body to comment on in PR pictures, but mostly because they are more mature and less aggressive than men. It can be argued back and forth whether these differences are purely 'societal, and therefore subject to change', or that 'these differences are largely genetic and biological, and cannot be altered much'. That is a pointless discussion. What we are dealing with here is the difference between free speech and death threats. You can say all the mysogenistic, crude things you want- people will see you for the useless moron you are, but once threats are made- serious or not- you have outstepped the bounds of public discourse and should be shunned, deleted, and documented by the proper authorities.
I don't know, I can't think about all this right now, but I will say that if it's possible to post Sierra's address online, could someone please post the addresses of the cowards threatening her? That would be fair play, and I would love to have a sit-down with these pricks and educate them on the life-lessons of violence.
-
"David Sugarman"
Thank you for your thoughtful comments. You're right: I shouldn't judge someone on the basis of one comment, and I will try restrain that impulse in the future.
As far as the police go, I think that we are all responsible for what we say. If I threaten to kill someone, it is no less of a crime if done on the Internet than if done face-to-face. Jurisdiction may be a problem, though.
I hope you have a good weekend.
-
Joan has a warrior personality
She blasts women scientists for not being as hardened and jaded as she is about sexism, but she didn't take the time to think about the circumstances in which Summers' comments were made and she didn't take the time to put herself in the shoes of a woman who has studied science, who has the kind of personality necssary to find science interesting enough to study.
Joan is a warrior. She prefers fighting to thinking or feeling. She didn't find science interesting enough to study.
I think that's why she rushed to the defense of Rosie O'Donnell, ignoring the fact that Rosie started that feud and was also the first one to use insults based on physical appearance. Which made her the opposite of the victim in that fight. She was the aggressor.
Being the hardened warrior that she is, Joan didn't even take ten seconds to think -- maybe Donald Trump is saving the life of a young alcoholic by getting her to her first rehab at such a young age.
She doesn't take time to think or feel. She looks out on the battlefield, figures out who her allies are and identifies her enemies, and then just goes to war.
That's not the kind of personality that will get you very far in science. In science you're supposed to be able to hold your own in a vigorous debate, true, but you're also supposed to nurture your openness to the universe and maintain some kind of childlike sense of wonder long past the age when this is acceptable in most adults.
-
Wow.
I've just read the last couple of pages of posts -- terrific insights. I get so much from these letters. Thank you.
-
With Apologies to Helen Reddy
I am woman, hear me whine
it comes from were the sun don't shine
And my carping and complaining never end!
so you've heard it all before
And now you're gonna hear some more
No one's ever gonna ignore me again
CHORUS
Oh yes I will whine
I will gripe moan and complain
Yes, I'll scream and weep
Until you feel my pain
I am helpless, I can't do anything
I am weak (weak)
I am incompetent (incompetent)
I am woman
-
Mouthy women
How many times have we seen this scenario -- a mouthy woman in a bar who is stirring the pot, goading and provoking all those around her.
After a time, someone gets tired of the noise and says something like, "pipe down, sister, we're trying to have a conversation here." Mouthy woman, true to form, talks back and gets in the guy's face.
The situation escalates. It ends with some guy, now branded "misogynist," led away in handcuffs and mouthy woman going "boo hoo hoo" for all to hear.
Some things never change.
-
Let me just quote the master himself
" Sick cultures show a complex of symptoms such as you have named . . . but a dying culture invariably exhibits personal rudeness. Bad manners. Lack of consideration for others in minor matters. A loss of politeness, of gentle manners, is more significant than is a riot. "
Sadly, it seems to hit women the most. :(
This post is not Salon's, but mine.
-
Hugh.
I have seen that scenario 0 times.
-
Something I just noticed.....
I think Patricia Schwartz is now posted with "No Name Given." I keep seeing defenses of Demi Moore, pot smoking and Donald Trump under that label that sound like classic Particia. Has anybody else noticed that?
-
Hugh
I also have seen that scenario 0 times. Perhaps I am encumbered by the fact that I do not know what a "mouthy" woman is.
-
Mouthy men
Hugh, I appreciate your honesty. I don't think "mouthiness" is a female trait (nor do you, I gather). I've heard more than enough mouthy men in bars. But you seem to be implying that Joan Walsh and Kathy Sierra are merely 'mouthy women' in 'bars.' Is this really what you mean?
Now, I'm a woman, and I'll admit I do sometimes get 'mouthy' for a reaction. I tend to do this in restaurants, not bars. There's something funny there -- a need to provoke and/or incite, maybe a need to be 'right' for a while. But I don't think this is a female trait; just a silly one that my male friends engage in as well.
I've done this on Salon too, always to my regret. (Maybe I'm doing it now? Maybe you were too? Want a drink?)
The problem is that women in general tend to get branded as 'mouthy' quite often, particularly when they are strong or are expressing views that are challenging to the status quo. They are treated as if they were merely speaking in bars, when they are actually engaging in discourse with their peers.
With Respect,
LBS