Letters to the Editor
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So it's both the homophobia AND the social disadvantages for you, Man
See, my question was supposed to tease out why you were so hostile to the idea of a gay child. I could see to possible lines of thinking: (1) plain old homophobia, or (2) the social disadvantages that gay people face every day.
I was hoping it would be #2, but you show plenty of #1 with comments like "hoo-ray when it comes to your son wearing a dress and sucking a dick." For starters, you're a straight man that has serious queer fear. That's why you're so scared of your "son sucking a dick." You don't really talk about lesbians or daughters, because you probably wouldn't care about them that much anyway. What a man with an inferiority complex about your own masculinity really wants out of a child is to live through that child, and you can only live through a STRAIGHT SON. Men who are secure in their manhood would not be as scared of having a gay son or daughter as you are.
Which brings me to #2, the social disadvantages argument. You say "To me it's just like haveing a retard of a kid - you love them 'til they die" to cite an extreme. I really don't think homosexuality and mental retardation are comparable. I think being a gay man is probably somewhat worse from a social disadvantages point of view than a straight, average-looking woman. The social disadvantages argument against gay children is not very strong because (1) loving and respecting your child isn't logically related to the social disadvantages they face in the ouside world, and (2) the social disadvantages gay people may not be as bad as other sectors of people -- would you love your child if they were just plain old ugly (which comes with its own social disadvantages)? what if your child were a woman (own social disadvantages)? what if they were not smart (lots of social disadvantages)? By contrast to the ugly and not-smart problems, the fact that your child simply prefers men to women or women to men seems quite insignificant, and, I repeat, I don't see how social disadvantages is at all related to your capacity to respect and love your child as you would any other.
The most disturbing part of what you said, thoug, is that you wouldn't "respect" your kid if the kid were gay. Here i thought that respect was something to be earned. People don't gain respect simply because of their genetics. One does not "respect" people simply for being white, male, or straight. So saying you wouldn't respect your kid simply because of his or her sexual orientation is truly bad, because it shows that you really have an inherent homophobia.
I think it's quite anti-American of you to give people respect based on characteristics they didn't earn -- their genetics.
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great article, thanks
Debra, I'm the white mother of a black son, and I really enjoyed your very thoughtful piece. My concerns are the opposite of yours--you feel your son's sense of blackness will come naturally, but a confident manhood won't. I'm not worried about my son's manhood (though I'm a bit worried he'll be a geek), but I am concerned about him being confident in his racial identity. I can't protect him with my white privelege, but I can work to try to eliminate it, which should help him in the long run, and I can work hard to make sure he has good role models of all races.
Interestingly, though, as a feminist, I feel better about raising a son than a daughter. I'm sure my son will have feminist values because that's how we live our lives (dad cooks dinner most nights while I work later, as one example). But I think most girls will eventually want to be thinner, cuter, etc. I think girls have a much harder time. So instead I feel like it's easier to raise a man, even a black man.
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George Thompson, i kind of with you up until:
I'll never get married, not in this country. There is a sickness here in America between men and women that cannot repaired. It is pure, unadulterated hatred and I will not take part in it anymore.
This article sums it up nicely.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=398998&in_page_id=1879
I mean, i hate to state the obvious, but the article is not from this country, it's from the UK. So i guess my question is, which country do you think is better? The US and UK are obviously out.
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re: See, my question was supposed to tease out why you were so hostile to the idea of a gay child. I could see to possible lines of thinking: (1) plain old homophobia, or (2) the social disadvantages that gay people face every day.
It's not a matter of hostility, it's a matter of choice. I already said I would love a gay child - what more do you want? You want me to lie and say this is what I would choose? I can't do that - but at least I'm honest, not like the liars here who say they'd welcome a gay son or lesbian daughter.
I know that liberals like to lie - I think they call it lying for justice.
I won't do that...
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Fascinating......
I had a series of similar conversations in the early 80s when both my wife and a friend were pregnant with first babies, sons. The other couple was same-sex of the female persuasion, and the non-pregnant partner of the pair and I talked quite a bit on this matter. She was chewing over some ideas about raising children, especially boys, as a lesbian in a committed relationship, and those talks and ideas eventually resulted in a book.
http://www.amazon.com/Lesbian-Parenting-Book-Creating-Families/dp/1580050905/sr=1-4/qid=1165854555/ref=sr_1_4/102-5336497-3857705?ie=UTF8&s=books
which has since had some newer iterations. I've visited Seattle every so often since leaving 20 years ago, and their baby has grown up to be a very decent young man.
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Refreshing honesty
Finally, a feminist who is honest enough to admit flat-out that she doesn't like men very much and 'feminism' is just her way of glossing political respectability over her prejudices.
Saying that is a lot more believable than dressing it up in pious 'equality' rhetoric that she doesn't take seriously.
Say what you will about her, the author of this article doesn't act phony about liking men in the way that 'Becca Traister does. I find the honesty to be oh-so refreshing.