"To see them produce a ninny and then follow him loyally into the swamp for five years is disconcerting, like seeing the Rolling Stones take up lite jazz."

I agree! what can we do? I wish I knew!

A.M., creativity CAN thrive while artists are STILL in their authoritative countries; they don't have to leave for it to thrive.and there are a myriad of causes for creative art (may i use the word creative, since GK did?)

And not being a Jesse Helms rethuglican, I dont think flaky stuff should be banned; just that it can exist in a tolerant society because it can find a market there among some suckers there who automatically assume that tolerant societies inevitably breed maximally creative art.

Main points, AM:

You can get creative and non-creative art forms in BOTH types of societies, and that we don't know the causes, but that despite (hey, perhaps sometimes in reaction to) authoritarian societies, you can actually get thriving creativity there. What inspires SOME very stark and expressive art? Hardship. Rebellion. How easily it become "public" is another matter.

There may be an optimal level of authoritarianism if creativity is the goal (again, BRD-Germany). Do some research or interviews, but don't assume (advice I also give to GK). It doesn't help the liberal (of which I am) cause.

But it doesn't mean I support the idea of authoritarianism-- just that it CAN POSSIBLY foment creative responses and that it AT LEAST contains them, and sometimes "thrivingly" so. BEFORE and WITHOUT emigration. It is a fact, which if you want to dispute it, dispute whether these things are creative by your definition, not whether they exist AND thrive. Because, in fact, they do.

Everytime this man writes a column I burst with pride at being from the heartland.

The bungling Hate Rightie who thinks only dumb-as-brick rightwing fundmentalists

live here is full of crap. I may not be a San Francisco liberal nor agree with them on ever last thing, but the GOP is a ticket to poverty for the heartland and everywhere else and they can take their phoney religous symbolism and choke on it. In the heartland it's Democrats who understand living Christly and simply.

I'd poke my eyes out with needles before I voted Republican as would anyone with a net worth of under 15 million and an ounce of sense.

Ps - Mr. Keillor, if you weren't married (and if I wasn't) I'd bunk right up to Minnesota and fight for you and win.

whetstone, thanks for pointing out to poster wheadley that I was responding to poster Ikpo's letter and not to Mr. Keillor's remarks.

Oh by the way Ikpo, thanks for sending me this through my website contact page. As you did not leave any contact info (other than your IP address) I will respond here. Besides, this is the forum you should stick to as it started here...

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// Below is the result of your feedback form. It was submitted by

() on Friday, June 09, 2006 at 11:28:53

name: lkpo

comments: Just saw your disrespective post to my salon post on Keillor. No, not "utter nonsense",

what I wrote. I now quote from the OED:

thrive, v. Of a person or community: To prosper; to increase in wealth; to be successful or

fortunate.

Yes, it pans out; creativity can thrive under authoritarianism, just as it can thrive in

non-authoritarian societies. The effects may (or may not) be different, but you're still mighty hard

pressed to defend against the loads of examples of creative artists living in authoritarian societies.

And they are a great plenty. Contrasted with some college towns some of whose inhabitants may think

they are creative, when they are not-- just flaky. \\

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Thanks for the dictionary definition of thrive. And sorry Ikpo, no disrespect towards you personally, just commenting on your opinion. My position is simply that I do not think authoritarianism creates thriving artists or communities. I never said creative artists did not live in authoritarian societies. They do however often escape from such societies, where they then may "thrive". Under authoritarian regimes only art that is approved by the regime is allowed public space. Certainly "flaky" art would not be allowed. Are you the authoritarian who will decide what art is? Me? Or the marketplace of free ideas and free thought?

Garrison's comment about the ipod and Baptists in Waco, Texas was one of the truest statements I can recall reading in recent memory.....channeling the best of both Mark Twain and Alice Roosevelt......terse and to the point.....I have already quoted this reference to many friends......and may just email it to my (Baptist) Sunday School class........

have you been paying attention??

Why insult high school wrestling coaches? That comes across as snobbery.

The role gay men have played in revitalizing run-down, blighted neighborhoods, and creating "historical districts" from "old" buildings, adopting special needs children; traditionally difficult to place among hetero families, and other generous and charitable contributions they make as a group.

But, the easiest way to hide your deficiencies is to point out (however unfairly) the percieved flaws and failings of others. As long as doing so keeps working for the Republicans, they will keep making sexual orientation an issue and a moral failing for those who are gay.

It's up to the voters to realize that their lives, future and freedoms are at stake in the coming elections, and to make their priorites not so much about what individuals do in their bedrooms, but what they do as representatives of us, the citizens, in the Whitehouse, and everywhere else.

Thanks for your of your succinct, apt (and, as always, well-written) point of view on this, Keillor.

"Go ahead, refute me, libs....explain how libs/progs do not make fun and constantly put down the folk in the heartland."

Many of us in the heartland are progressive liberals. Your remarks are a ridiculous generalization apropos to nothing.

The smart one's coming in '08, Garrison.

I do resent that remark, Mr. Keillor. I am the JV wrestling coach at an inner-city high school in Phoenix, AZ and I have a B.S. in Environmental Biology. I am also the least educated of the coaches on our staff. Both the Varsity coach and the Freshman coach have B.A.s and M.A.s in Education. In addition, the Varsity coach has a Masters degree in Theology. We also have a volunteer coach who is a well-respected local surgeon. In fact, I could name wrestling coaches at many of our rival high schools with equally impressive credentials.

I dare say we are all quite a bit smarter, and more well-rounded, than Rep. Hastert.

Football coaches, on the other hand...