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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
Driving someone insane with that kind of solitary confinement definitely qualifies as torture. If someone kept a dog or a cat under those kind of isolated conditions, with so little contact or mental stimulation, they'd be considered grossly inhumane and unfit to care for an animal.
Torture is inexcusable. Period.
Why does humanity have such a hard time grasping this very basic principle?
is for the fact that he clearly was raised by wolves. If your child sends you emails talking about how horrific his daily life is--one abuse after another--and then sends you pictures documenting it, you contact his commanding officers and the authorities immediately (1) to stop the abuse, and (2) to stop your child from continuing to psychologically harm himself as well as others. You seek out a very reputable therapist and hire a kick-ass lawyer and hope that you can keep that little boy on Santa's lap from devolving into a monster. What you don't do is nothing. What you do NOT do is excuse his behavior and whine about his punishment.
Granger deserves his jail time and he very clearly needs medication and intensive therapy for his sadistic impulses. Period. I'm disappointed that Salon would conflate outrage over the fact that his superiors were not punished with sympathy for this criminal. I urge this writer to think the issue through again.
Here's the hut:
"No end, and no apparent limit, to the bashing of Cheney and Rumsfeld. Still, no word from Mark Benjamin, supporting his allegation...that there had been "orders" regarding torture/abuse.
The quote, from Mark Benjamin, that I have challenged: "Years of revelations, however, show that the prisoner abuse started at the top, yet nobody who ordered the abuse has ever been tried or convicted of anything."
OK, Elephant, you're right. Not one of the convicted soldiers claimed to have been directly ordered to do each specific action of prisoner torture. But now that you're done with that pin-sized strawman, do you really think that from Rumsfeld on down that this entire "policy" wasn't wink-winked into existence by those in positions of authority who knew they weren't legally culpable if it ever came out. And yet they were still encouraging of said policy. Sometimes encouragement is all the mouth-breathers of the world need (just look at the majority of "eye-for-an-eyer"s on this thread), and the higher ups knew it.
The fact that Graner (and others) had a pre-determined predilection to cruelty apparently didn't raise any red flags in the military system. And why should it. They're not exactly the best and brightest anymore, are they? They're more likely to be the last-best-hope'rs or the its-either-this-or-jail'ers. None with a lick of college or any real critical thinking skills to speak of. No wonder no one needed to issue formal "orders".
So the question is: At what point do you start doing your Nicholson "You can't handle the truth" routine so we can chuckle knowingly to ourselves thinking "Sure, it's us who can't handle the truth".
I'm surprised you even have the temerity to stick your nose into these parts anymore, seeing how completely wrong you've been about almost everything. Just add one more thing to the list, I guess.
63 years after the end of WW II, people still debate the degree of culpability of the "average German citizen" for the horrors perpetrated by their leaders.
In the years ahead, will we so judged, as well? Will it require an international tribunal to try our war criminals, because we lack the moral fortitude to do it ourselves?
Of course "We just want to put the whole thing behind us." So did the good citizens of Germany after the War. Should we be allowed to do so? NO!
Most of what he did was for his own amusement. He wasn't ordered by superiors to do these things. He did what he wanted to do to civilian prisoners. THAT should end this discussion. He's an asshole.
He was written up in civilian life for brutality to prisoners multiple times as a civilian guard. He should have been in jail long before now. Absolute power corrupts absolutely and he got unchecked power, due to the Bush administration's destruction of the line of command. Too many civilian contractors were running around with protocol ranks. The civilians should not have been there in the first place. Graner simply took the opportunity to inflict pain in a way that gave him pleasure. The bastard gets off on inflicting pain and humiliation. He was, and is, a sadistic bastard. I hope he dies there.
Most Salonistas have never visited anyone in prison. I have. Everyhting described here is normal. He is not being treated especially harshly. Strip searches for a former guard, who knows how to smuggle stuff in? Normal. Please. This man is no where near to being tortured.
I agree that elements of his command should still be there. I think Lynnie England et al should STILL be in prison. I have no sympathy for him.
So the government is driving him insane.
Because he'd red, white and blue clear through -- when they have those fascistic rallies at the beginnings of sports events and every patriotic, obedient American's heart swells at the lyrics to our national anthem ".. home of the free, and land of the brave" his face ought to be plastered, grinning, on every Jumbotron while that "detainee" dressed in trash bags and wired with electrodes is symbolically fried for no crime, kind of like a NASCAR-themed Burning Man.
The future? Picture a boot stomping on a human face... forever.
Chuck Graner is out man. Is represents the US better than anyone except possibly George W. Bush, our 43rd President.
You bought it, you paid for it, you drive it off the lot. Embrace the horror. This is what America has become. The rest of this planet knows it even though the news hasn't quite reached home yet.
"land / of the / braaaaaave" Bzzzzzzt screams of agony, fade to black.
My vengeful side remembers stories about Graner's treatment of prisoners on his "civilian" job before he was shipped overseas. Let's just say Graner isn't on my sympathetic list. He is being treated no differently than any prisoner in the country who has the misfortune of being in Administrative Segragation. having friends inside "the system" i know there are far too many guards just like him inside. karma is indeed a beeyotch.
The "all people are humans and deserve a chance to rehab ilitate" side of me is absolutely appalled at Graner's treatment, just as I am about this treatment of far too many prisoners in the US, who will one day be walking the streets I walk on, sicker, more twisted and with fewer copiing skills than when they went in. We should NOT treat people in this fashion. Crimes or not, they are still humans.
Now I do believe Graner is singled out for having been caught. Too bad the people who were giving tacit approval for this treatment are still walking free, ready to makke more graners, and worse probably working in the system making more crazy people to be loosed on the world.
Much of the initial coverage about Fort Hood turned out to be wrong. Is there anything wrong with that?
The accountability imposed by another country for the CIA's kidnapping and torture reveals much about our own.
Fox News' morning show plays to type, talking about whether Muslims in the Army should face "special debriefings"
The survivor and author is upset about comparisons some on the right are making to genocide
219 Democrats and one Republican join in favor of the legislation, which passed by a narrow margin
Salon headlines in your mailbox
