Site Presented By
Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
have been maimed or killed directly because of the actions of Graner and those who sanctioned him and his immediate cohort? How much more indelible and recursively actionable the hatred of us? The upshot of his behavior indisputably extends far beyond a simple abstract sullying of our national moral character. It can be enumerated via an elevated trail of permanently broken bodies and corpses. Charles Graner, his colleagues, and their superiors all have the blood of countless Americans and innocent Iraqis on their hands.
I think that after hearing the descriptions of what is being done to Graner, the people who have written here on this board that he is getting exactly what he deserves, that torturing him is just fine and dandy with them because of what he did, are using the same logic that our wonderful Administration used in torturing the prisoners at Abu Gharib. Let's face it, the reason that Graner is still in prison is that the people who were really responsible for Abu Ghraib have managed to slip quietly under the presses radar (Donald Rumsfeld for instance) and don't want to be bothered now that they are there.
I notice that one of you said that Graner deserves to be in prison because he was in charge of his unit, yet the person who said that made no reference to the fact the the real leaders of the operation, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Yoo, and others are probably going to get away scott free. They will get away with it all unless we demand from the Obama Administration that the people on the top be prosecuted. So let's put aside our outrage at what Graner did, and stop stupidly blaming him for carrying out the orders he was given, and go after the people who gave the orders.
Graner came to the MP with a long, established, ugly record of racist, cruel and bullying behavior as a PA corrections officer. I admire the inherent decency of one of the earlier posters, but I heartily disagree with him or her, and I do believe that Graner enjoyed every minute of what he did at Abu Ghraib. The photos belie any presumption of alleged "coercion" or "order-following" on Graner's behalf. The point of the article is not whether others should be held responsible -- his superiors (up to and incl WH-OSC and DOD) clearly should be. But "sympathy for Graner" (or Sabrina Harman, that beneficiary of Errol Morris's whitewash)? No. Never. They got their jollies. They humiliated and they tortured and they killed with patent glee. They shamed their fellow service members. They acted -- in OUR names -- in the most filthy, reprehensible manner. Never.
My sympathies lie with their victims. Sorry I haven't enough to share with the perpetrators.
You either HAVE values or you don't. I had them when I arrived from the UK in 2001, right after 9/11 and I maintained them ever since. I took flak and still take flak for having values. I am relieved to see over the last 18 months that America HAS come to its senses. The people who actually denigrate me for speaking out are fewer and fewer. I am amazed when I send my links to my rants and videos, about strafing civilians in dust bowl streets as being corrupt, that these days I get agreement and collusion. Very many want to turn a leaf and not go that same way ever again. As a parent had I received photos like that I would told my son to think again and if he could not, then never to involve me in such awful behavior again. I might even have been the one to 'blow the whistle'. What IS the matter with you guys? I served in Germany five years 61-66 and saw that behavior of troops can decline but I tried to keep my values when I saw others give in to temptation. I personally would not have been that upset were they caught. Have you seen 'Platoon'. Did it not make you sick? Did it not determine that you would not succumb to such things. We blamed Germans for what happened there? Should we not then blame American voters for their second term choice. What DID you vote for? You knew what was going on right?
Sometimes I think this whole world is one big prison yard, some of us are prisoners, and the other of us are guards. B. Dylan
Rummy is not just polishing his flies, but counting all the monies he has made from pharmaceuticals. He made a mint on w's rip off of Medicare/Medicaid for prescription medicines.
Halliburton is now a Dubai Corporation after having made 60-80 billion dollars--all from the tax coffers provided by the American People. Dicky filed income tax returns for 2006 showing income of over 16 million and pooh poohing it in some grumbling manner and no one has followed this up. Remember his 'severance pay' was supposedly $20,000,000 at the time the Supreme Court made him VP.
Bugliosi is absolutely ranting that if he has anything to do with it, w will not live the 'high life' never regretting 10% of his sins. At least we know that even with a no-name biographer, w cannot sell a book right now. He has sent his book to every single Federal D.A. in the country demanding justice against w and his cohorts.
Barack could set a new precedent by allowing pardons in the beginning of his Administration to people who have absolutely nothing to do with him. Every Blue Moon, I will agree with a basic conservative sentiment. Not only should anybody in prison because of the Abu Ghraib mess be freed but I think those two border guards that fat head racist Dobson keeps talking about should also be freed.
Why not set up panels all over the ocuntry and free ten per cent of everyone in prison today? We imprison more people than China and China has 4 times our population. The Executive Branch is the only tool to get in there and do something about it.
I do not wish to free baby killers or baby rapists or serial killers. They represent a small percentage of our prison population.
But Americans imprisoned for growing or selling maryjane is laughable.
Rummy is a hundred and five and Dicky, whose cardiac history looks a lot like Redd Foxx, aint going to be around much longer.
Obama loses nothing in terms of political capital in having a panel reexamine our prison/justice system.
Republicans lover the expression: "Life is unfair." And that is because they work so hard to make it so.
Much of the initial coverage about Fort Hood turned out to be wrong. Is there anything wrong with that?
The accountability imposed by another country for the CIA's kidnapping and torture reveals much about our own.
Fox News' morning show plays to type, talking about whether Muslims in the Army should face "special debriefings"
The survivor and author is upset about comparisons some on the right are making to genocide
Once seen as a lunatic fringe, reactionary anti-women groups are courting respectability
Salon headlines in your mailbox
