". . . . Instead, commanders find themselves relying on numbers, which is how body counts began to creep into the Iraq war, despite their explicit disavowal by former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld in 2003 ("We don't do body counts")."

Wasn't that answer Rumsfeld's response to a question about how many innocent Iraqis had been "liberated" from life by the Bushit criminal enterprise's illegal invasion and occupation of backward non-threatening Iraq?

If so, then in that instance he was sort of telling the truth in a twisted way:

"First, we label every dead Iraqi, men, women, and children -- without ddiscrimination, because we believe in equal treatment, after all -- a 'terrorist,' THEN we count their bodies."

By that same means I think the US managed to kill more Viet Cong than had ever existed.

Rumsfeld clearly learned from Vietnam. Problem is he learned only the wrong lessons.

...And you are also a dimwit.

In your mind, America and especially white American males are always wrong. We`ve heard it all ad nauseum. Whatever the subject, you will turn it to how white American males have screwed it up and if only we could be lead by females, preferably black/Asian/hispanic/muslim persons of doubtful gender.

Facts are we won WWII by kicking butt and killing people. That`s called war. If we hadn`t done it the other guys would. If we were not nice, they were abominable. Get over it and have a nice day.

By the way, I`m a man.

Don't loose sight of the fact you are drafting men to kill or be killed. Those drafted will be young men with still malleable minds The military's first job will still be to drive out "common decency and common sense" draftees may have, the be replaced with what will keep them alive. All we can do is hope/ pray that saves more soldiers lives, than it kills innocent civilians.

Nowhere do I say these words are used incorrectly. I was being critical of author's _over_use of long and obscure terms (in my opinion.) Nebulous is lovely word, but is it really necessary when vague will do?

I will note that a few lines later the author has paraphrased his usage of nebulous with "in addition to the vague rules of engagement..." so I stand by my original substitution.

However, this argument over semantics seems petty given the subject matter. I was as shocked and disgusted as anyone.

Ok.

So when the administration justifies going to war because Saddam's WMDs are an imminent threat, but they're wrong, does that count as a "screw up?"

And when the entirety of the (educated) world realizes they were wrong and possibly lying, does that count as "getting caught?"

What are the next two steps again?

Are we not supposed to be showing Iraqis how democracy works? Did we not overthrow and kill Saddam Hussein for committing barbarous acts of torture and killing innocents?

Those who point out the evil deeds of Al Quaeda and other criminals masquerading as "martyrs" COMPLETELY MISS THE POINT. We are supposed to represent a society that does better than that. Of course the bad guys chop off heads, etc. That's why they are BAD. That is not supposed to be our way. Is this behavior the kind of thing a so-called "Christian" nation can be proud of?

In order to claim moral superiority over terrorists--we have to actually BE morally superior. And not just launch some BS Republican public relations campaign all about lies--we actually have to walk the walk.

If the military is starting to do body counts in a war where friend and foe cannot be distinguished, we need to bring the troops home NOW. If this is what we are doing, we have lost our way over there. Democrats have been cowards and have kowtowed to the barbarians among us. BRING THEM HOME. Before we end up with more Sgt. Hensleys. I do not want to work or live next to the Sgt. Hensleys ( guys who'd kill you to please the boss).

(And PS: I am not a pacifist and I have relatives in the service.)

You, sir, are a murderer. I will pray a Novena asking the Blessed Virgin Mary to implore her Son to strike you down with testicular cancer and give you the horrifying death you so deserve before consigning you to Hell for Eternity. Your mother must curse the day she bore you, and if she doesn't, she's a fool.

and then later found chopped into pieces. Well, at least we can sleep at night about that.

The incident was investigated and the soldiers punished as war criminals, as they should have been. What I don't see is the connection to any alleged policy to increase "body counts." Blame the war not on our soldiers, who by and large are doing their jobs and abiding by the rules of engagement the best they can, given that the enemy is not wearing a uniform, and blame the President and the Congress which initally supported and endorsed the war, which includes John Edwards, John Kerry, and Hillary Clinton.

Please come back to Salon, and tell us more in the future. We hunger and thirst for first-person information.

I THOUGHT I WOULD NEVER LIVE TO AGAIN SEE

THE BANEFUL DESCRIPTIVE TAG OF "ATROCITY"

BUT CONSIDERING WHO IS THE commander-in-THIEF

I KNOW MY RESPITE WAS REALLY BRIEF

FROM THE EXCESSES OF VIETNAM FAR ACROSS THE SEA!!!!!

LIKE VIETNAM, Iraq IS A MISTAKEN AND CRIMINAL WAR

SPURRED ON BY WARMONGING IDIOTS AND CRIMINALS, BY GAR!

MIXED IN A CAULDRON OF HUMAN SUFFERING AND FEAR

THEN QUAFFED BY TMIC* LIKE A SMALL GLASS OF BEER!!!!!

THE INNOCENT BYSTANDERS WISH FOR SALVATION UPON A STAR!!!!!

*The Military Industrial Complex

I just finished my fourth tour in Iraq with a Marine reconnaissance unit (our missions are similar to those of the snipers in the article), and feel compelled to share my perspective on this, because the topic of justifiable kills is an important one, morally complex, and perhaps confusing to those who haven't been in such situations themselves. You can pin a lot of bad things on the Brass--and God knows I do; most of them are incompetent, obsequious desk jockeys, and I almost always side with the guys in the field--but not this time. Most battalion commanders are too restrictive with their rules of engagement these days, and it scares us to think that if we kill someone innocent by mistake--even if we think we have identified hostile intent--we will get fried in a heartbeat. This particular battalion commander seems very generous with his rules of engagement, but despite pressing his soldiers to get more kills, nothing he said could reasonably be interpreted by any soldier as authorization to execute non-hostiles. Apart from the possibility that the heat and the amount of water these guys were drinking (which can lower blood sodium content, causing alteration of mental status)affected their judgement, what these guys did was absolutely inexcusable and unprofessional. I hate to back a colonel over a sergeant, but I admire the battalion commander for pushing aggressive ROEs. Don't think that these snipers were children with no ability to judge right and wrong or to interpret the nuances of their ROEs. They killed this guy for absolutely no reason, and that's that.