Yes, that is what we are. Bzzz... we are the drones... we carry pollen (that is, small donations) to the King Bee... Bzzz... and when he is elected, you will be assimilated into the hive... Bzzz... join us... join us...

Seriously? Stuff it, AKA.

If the point isn't that Hillary plagiarized, why are you saying that she did?

How did I get through college? I always wrote my own stuff. It got me both a BA and MA in English. As a teacher, I flunked more than a few plagiarizers. I would put attempts witting and witless at plagiarizing among first year college students at about 15%.

Maybe this is whence this support for Obama as a plagiarizer. He is pulling the plagiarizer vote.

What, now you get to make up whatever definition of "plagiarism" suits your argument?

This is from dictionary.com:

plagiarism: "the unauthorized use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work."

Funny, I don't see anything about it having to be "word for word"!

So if I re-write "Gone With the Wind" using the exact same storyline and construction of chapters, with the exact same characters in the exact same situations, but I periodically change the word "but" to "yet" or the word "green" to "emerald," it's not plagiarism? Bull-shit.

Note also above where the definition says that plagiarism is the unauthorized use of another's work. That sure as hell doesn't fit the Obama example.

My god, AKA Smith, you have turned into a "defend-Hillary-at-all-costs!" machine with no reasoning ability of your own. Why not just admit that Hillary has stumbled badly here and move on?

No, but how do we know that he didn't get the general idea from him?

If you think she plagiarized, post up each quoted and examine them side-by-side if you will, and prove plagiarism. You can't do that because they aren't that close.

Oh, you're an English instructor, not a proffesor of English. That's about the same thing as teaching gym. What's the matter? Couldn't get your P.H.D? Miss. Smith, for all the smarts you do so sorely lack, you are nothing but a ranting hack.

From http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/

Tonight, Sen. Obama said: “In Youngstown, Ohio, I talked to workers who have seen their plants shipped overseas due to consequences of poor deals it's like NAFTA that have literally seen equipment unbolted from the floors of factories and shipped to China.” [CNN Univision Debate, 2/21/08]

John Kerry in 2004: “What does it mean in America today when Dave McCune, a steel worker I met in Canton, Ohio, saw his job sent overseas and the equipment in his factory literally unbolted, crated up, and shipped thousands of miles away along with that job?” [Kerry Remarks, Democratic Convention, 7/29/04]

So is that plagiarism? Or is it not? Did Obama plagiarize again? Not in the above, but he did plagiarize when he used the words of Deval Patrick without attribution. Yes he did.

No, but how do we know that he didn't get the general idea from her?

aka smith. you must be off your meds.

A quick flip through your history shows that you've posted about 17 pages' worth of letters on this "plagiarism" topic. You're not convincing anyone. Give it up.

By the way, it's spelled "copyright," not "copywrite." I think I prefer to take my lessons on the subject from someone who can spell it.

No, but how do we know that he didn't get the general idea from her?

By the same logic, Deval Patrick might well have gotten his original speech from Barack Obama.

I posted enough of the two quotes in my original post. However, if you want to know what Bill Clinton said, word for word, listen to what Hillary Clinton said last night about the "hits" she takes because they were exactly the same. How do I know "he didn't get it from him?" It is hard to resist assuming that you are so upset that you are now prone to silly typos. I'm guessing that you you meant "he didn't get it from her. "If that is what you meant my response is: If it were me, and I had just charged my opponent with stealing speeches, I would be very careful to make the origin of my "the hits I take" comparison very clear so that uneducated, cowardly hotheads like me wouldn't have ammo to use in a forum like this.

I would like to say that calling people cowardly and second-guessing their education is poor form, especially for a Hillary Clinton supporter. Please stop.

go back to teaching gym.

I understand Hillary Clinton did a thesis on Saul Alinsky. She undoubtedly studied him and I guess met him. But that was nothing like the relationship between Alinsky and Obama.

But Alinsky took Obama under his wing. He was Obama's mentor and leader in social mobilization and community activism. And he was a true marxist. I understand one of his precepts was the end justifies the means: do anything to win, say anything to win. After all, after you win, then you can put the program you really want into action. Lenin and his 121 henchment did not take over Russia by telling people what they really wanted to do. Slogans were their only message, and everyone could read whatever they wanted into it. "Change" is a perfect example.

the passage

We are fine,

But is the country fine?

was copied in two ways: first, the concepts (self, country, fineness), second, the technique (parallelism). Some other words were changed to avoid recreating the bit verbatim.

The YouTube clip is the same sort of deal.

you're totally right. He's for "change," therefore he is a communist. How could we all have been so blind?

Post a link showing that he plans to use "Das Kapital" as the backbone of his economic plan or STFU.

AKA Smith: "If the point isn't that Hillary plagiarized, why are you saying that she did?"

Duhhh.... Are you senile? How did you get through college? I explained this quite clearly already. Let me explain it really slowly for you one more time:

The point is not that Hillary plagiarized Bill's words. If that were the only thing that happened, devoid of the context of Hillary's accusation against Barack Obama, then we would not be having this conversation.

The point is that Hillary has gone very pointedly on the attack against Obama for plagiarism due to an extremely minor instance in which he used three sentences that a friend of his authorized him to use because he felt they would be effective.

Nevermind that this does not fit the definition of plagiarism (which I posted here from dictionary.com), which says plagiarism is the unauthorized use of words and ideas of another person.

And now what we have with the YouTube video (once again: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ7Cs3QvT3U&feature=bz301) is an instance where Hillary Clinton also appropriated the lines of somebody else's speech to make as her own. No, they were not word-for-word, but they were close, and "word for word" is not the definition of plagiarism anyway (as you have attempted to claim).

I don't necessarily think Hillary Clinton's copying of Bill's words is technically plagiarism either, but if it isn't, then you have to admit that it isn't for Barack Obama. If you say it is plagiarism for Obama, then you are logically required to admit that it is also plagiarism for Hillary Clinton.

The entire point of all of this has nothing to do with who's a plagiarist and who's not -- those are just building-block elements. The bottom-line point is that Hillary Clinton has made a very severe accusation against somebody for a practice that she has now been revealed to have engaged in herself.

The logic in the above reasoning is impeccable. The only way for you to contest it is further obfuscation tactics, which seem to be your stock in trade. You are merely trying to hold off from admitting anything for as long as you can. There is no integrity in that.

Further, your attempts to side-line the conversation into the John Edwards quote (which is somewhat less obviously an example of copying), and especially your use of spurious and insulting attacks on other people's "hive minds" or "lack of education" exposes the extent to which you have subordinated your integrity and reason to your Hillary allegiance.

AKA Smith: "How did I get through college? I always wrote my own stuff. It got me both a BA and MA in English. As a teacher, I flunked more than a few plagiarizers. I would put attempts witting and witless at plagiarizing among first year college students at about 15%."

Then you should know the definition of plagiarism. Your example above just underlies the problem with people who take their teaching authority so seriously that they forget to realize that we are all perpetual students. Your educational authority is not absolute, and it does not free you from the responsibility for admitting when you make a mistake. I know people like you, who think they are so above it all that they never have to learn anything new. It is a coarse and ugly direction for an educator to go in. You might consider becoming a student again -- somebody capable of learning and seeing things for what they are.

AKA Smith: "Maybe this is whence this support for Obama as a plagiarizer. He is pulling the plagiarizer vote."

Clearly, in your case, Hillary is pulling the hypocrite vote.

I am done with you.