Letters to the Editor
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Oh that sad, little man...
It never ceases to amaze me how much somebody like D'Souza can claim to be so in tune with American values, yet not see how people sympathetic to Osama Bin Laden could be weary of occupation by a foreign power. After all, we certainly wouldn't tolerate it, not even in the grimmest of circumstances. I could have sworn that a large part of our own independence came from severing ties with the British, and that many of our excursions which D'Souza and friends have cheerleaded for (unless it was Bill Clinton making the decisions, of course) so many years were based on one state occupying another. Plenty of conservatives and liberals alike would become suicide bombers if things were being run by and for the interests of another state, with a severely different culture, and thus all that more threatening. Throw in their troops on our streets, occasionally (or regularly) misbehaving towards Americans, and yeah...I think we can see why people in the middle east aren't particularly worried about what D'Souza claims--they're worried about becoming the next Palestine.
Religion and values, across the board, are of course important in this conflict, but religion only affects a culture, and the same religion rarely affects two places the same way. So when put against nationalism or security, those values have always taken a backseat, if not been temporarily forgotten. We can go back to the time to the most religiously divisive eras to see this in action; the Shahs of Saffavid Iran did not have a moral dilemma about seeking the aid of Christian nations against the Ottoman Empire, nor did the French have qualms allying with the Ottomans against the Hapsburgs. And speaking of Islam, many of the first Islamic empire's expansions into Byzantine territory were greatly aided by the fact that the church persecuted many in Egypt, Armenia, and the middle east over theological differences, e.g. the Council of Chalcedon. Many cities saw Muslim armies, even if complete and utter heretics in their eyes, as better landlords than the church or the emperor, and put up little, if any struggle; plenty of sources even describe relief. Last but not least, Osama bin Laden apparently must have snapped re: abortion, gay rights, women's suffrage, etc, in the United States sometime after Russia left Afghanistan, becomes he didn't seem to mind us so much then.
Or maybe, it was when we left US soldiers in Saudi Arabia? And of course this resentment would have much to do with the Mecca and Medina, but that is one factor alongside the fact that he, along with many in Saudi Arabia, felt completely insulted that the Saudi royal family had spent billions on US arms, built up a rather impressive military, yet was still subservient to the US when faced with a crisis. That they undeniably limited their military strength to prevent a coup for so many years, knowing all the time that they could depend on their friends in America, did not help.
Security, pride, and nationalism (even before it had a name, or referred to modern nation states per se) trump religious concerns or values. If anything, Islam has provided a glue for the many different groups who have little else in common, other than their concerns with increasing western intervention, not simply influence, in their part of the world. Sure, many would rise up and use violence against the west simply because of their religion or values, but those people are not going to recruit as many as those whose resistance is based on security and independence. I would think that eventually one of these neoconservative "policy wonks" (I use the term loosely, as "wonk" entails being good at something) would get the picture, but I have a feeling I will keep being disappointed. Life is complex, and it has only become more so since the end if the Cold War--a time in which the neocons obviously long for, no doubt while being completely oblivious to how wrong they were about that one, too.
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short-sighted hypocrites
how often conservatives who whine about "liberal values" turn out to go see "those movies", watch "those videos", listen to "that music", buy "those products" et cetera.
and the fact is that the entire western world has been going through something called "the enlightenment" for generations now - and it's too bad if the rest of the world has to struggle with it too, little simple things like treating all people like people, including women, and overcoming stupid crap like ethnicity and ignorance and dogma. too bad those backwards, reactionary people will be backwards and reactionary, whether in america or in the middle east or anywhere else. the world may still be progressing towards a semblance of intelligence but it sure is taking a long time - hundreds if not thousands of years.
to look only at the most recent generation and only at america in the absence of any historical context is just so typical of these short-sighted hypocrite conservatives.
history is alive. it's all one piece. wake up and smell the future
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Once again
This is a fine interview, where the subject is allowed to explain his point of view; and challenged on the basis of his claims. I don't see why Salon can't do this with the equally wacko Camille Paglia, who always gets a fawning pass.
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Give me a break ...when he gets targeted by right wing racists ...who will be there for him?
I really wanna know.
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liberals are hypocites
I have always been stunned at the liberals who love diversity and multi-culturalism but won't associate with other whites who aren't as rich as they are. That's why liberals are accused of being clueless. Because they are. They don't talk to working class whites, or give them jobs or hang out with them. They don't leave their middle class enclaves. They go straight from private schools in priveleged enclaves to universities to jobs Daddy lined up for them and repeat the cycle. They don't know their own people, by that I mean other Americans. They are the most coddled, isolated people on the planet. They remind me of Marie Antionette, and we know what happened to her.
Even if working class people manage to sneak into the university or scrape money together to attend horse camp or ballet lessons, the affluent won't speak to them. I don't know if it's arrogance or fear or both. But rich white people are laughingly cluesess. Oh, and they all want to vote for Barrack Obama to prove how hip and cool and open to diversity they are. They want to give diversity slots at state universities to affluent foreigners at the expense of working class who are better qualified to prove how hip they are. And they want to wipe out the working class by giving jobs to illegal aliens to prove how open to diversity they are. And then crawl back into their rich enclaves and only associate, not with diverse people, but with people who are exactly like themselves.