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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
Disillusionment with being asked to fight and die for no reason sound like a pretty normal response to me. The real psychological problems can be found in our leaders, who continue to sacrifice other peoples' lives in a futile attempt to salvage their own egos and reputations. There is nothing more to be gained in Iraq, but they can't or won't admit that to themselves, so nothing significant will be done until enough soldiers have died that the public demands a withdrawal.
-Jeremy
All the posts so far are from ignorant jerks, or just plain clueless idiots. I'm a Vietnam vet May 67 thru May 68. I saw a lot of people wounded, but spent most of my tour in 25th Inf Div HQ in G-3.
Even without much direct combat experience, I still have occasional reminders from then; similar to PTSD.
I don't care how many video games you've played; if you haven't been in actual combat, you just don't get it.
Being a phony Rambo who was a phony anyway played by a coward porno actor who went to Canada to hide out just don't cut it; aka that puke Stallone.
So step up and volunteer for the army as a frontline infantryman, or shut the F**k up.
You lost all respect for "those people"? Lady you got your ass so high you could shit in a mailbox.
It's true many young men a and women signed up to fight, or went into the National Guard looking for a college degree. But they weren't as smart as you are. You trump them in every way, don't you? You didn't fall for that propaganda. They must be some real dumb shits to go to Iraq, get their asses shot off, get burned up, blown up, fucked up.
But that's how it is with young people. Some are not smart. Some only get smart after they come back. And then they run into some fuckin' goddamn smartass like you who never stops reminding them of what a a bunch of dumb shits they were.
What a miserable sorry ass piece of shit you are.
Nobody asked you! Nobody asked you to wave the flag or put a support the troops ribbon on your car, but as a Vietnam combat vet who hates Bush and wants our troops out of Iraq, I would appreciate it very much if you would just step back and keep your fucking mouth shut when our young men and women come marching home, or crawling home, or wheeling home in a chair, because you fucking bitch, you're not fit to lick their spit off the sidewalk.
Your letter displays part of the problem discussed in this article. These men and women come home to a community that doesn't understand what they've experienced or who they are.
While my husband was deployed I went to a Move On event. I met a couple who assumed that all military members were neo-cons. They had no idea that there are military members who don't agree with this war. We talked about life as a military spouse and my husband's experiences. I felt that after our conversation they would treat any military member with compassion and respect.
These men and women are numbers on the news between weather and sports. I believe that understanding their humanity would ease their homecomings.
I'd like to also say that I am personally offended by your comments. My husband is a veteran and by no means racist (he's white, I'm biracial) or jingoistic. You sound as if it was their choice to invade Iraq. If someone hit you with a hammer would you blame the hammer? Bush is the one weilding the power of the armed forces and because he's thrown us into an unjust war you spew hatred for military members. The assertion that these people willingly said "Yeah, I'll kill a few people to get a degree." is absurd. It also shows that you are ill informed. My delivery may differ from Ebonius but I agree with the sentiment.
Maybe you should actually try to meet someone in the military and ask about their experiences. You might actually learn something.
In the meantime here's a suggestion. Stop insulting men and women who are dying every day. Between people like you and the neo-cons our military members are getting no support.
To our 'President', troops are just numbers on a piece of paper. They aren't real people. We are expendable...all of us...we simply do not matter. He'll 'surge' the troops until there are no more to sacrifice. Who knows what he'll do after that. Death and distruction of us or the Iraqis doesn't mean anything because we are as real to him as the Constitution.
Not stressed in the article is that U.S. fighting forces have the purpose of fighting not policing. Currently forces are acting as police which means they are not performing their prime duties, the duties for which they are trained. Most military personnel abhor the notion of keeping the peace. It is not their job. When anyone is assigned job responsibilities that are outside their job description, morale will be lowered. Morale is what allows an armed force to be successful, on and off the field of battle.
Considering “off the field of battle”, I have always been amazed at how poorly veterans in this country are treated. Is it because most noncoms are from the less elite social classes? Or, ...why? In my opinion, anyone who serves this country by volunteering their life should enjoy a much better slice of the pie after leaving active duty. For the lifetime of a veteran there should be free and high quality health and life insurance, and greatly discounted or eradicated federal income taxes on their salaries. There should also be a return to the more liberal “GI Bill” form of job/educational training. Much can be learned from a society when studying how that society treats those that do the necessary “dirty work”.
The notion that everyone there is an ignorant barely out of teen years grunt is nonsense. The very fact that nearly half of the contingent there is reserve or NG shows that the average age of those serving, unlike Vietnam is quite a bit older, perhaps as old as the mean age in WW2 if not more. Many people over there are nearly middle aged, have their own families and so on. They're not babies. And whatever their motivation was and continues to be they often are caught up in having to serve based on decisions they made years ago. Were they smart then? Maybe, maybe not. In either case, here they are now and looking back in anger is pointless. They know now that signing up in peacetime can mean getting shot at in a hot war. And regardless of the potential benefits of signing up, the downside of getting shot at can and does present itself.
On the other hand you know that distance runners peak in their late 20's early thirties because it takes emotional and mental tenacity that comes with age. So the very fact that stress is probably a significant factor here and now shows that stress is quite high and people are not coping with it well nor are they being supported. That should tell you something. I'm not sure it has anything to do with disillusionment or any other political motives. After all all grunts get disillusioned with having to sit in the dirt and do what they're told. And garrison duty is doubly stressful. Perhaps instead it has to do with the simple reality of the duty cycle, long deployments and a sense that they are being used and abused over and over with little end in sight. Perhaps it's the very cynicism that comes with age that gives them the mental toughness to survive that ultimately makes them implode with anger at it all.
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Salon headlines in your mailbox
