Letters to the Editor
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In authoritarian (read traditonal) religions there is no distinction between
being allowed to freely practice your religion and the right to use the police power of the govt., social intimidation, economic pressure, etc to force everyone to follow your sect's rules. The US was formally founded on the legal principle of freedom of religion, freedom of speech, everyone endowed with inalienable human rights, but when, after 200 years, steps were taken to create a society where these ideas had a practical applilcation and were not just an abstract and unpractced principle, by, among other things, outlawiwng the enforcement of a racial caste system, by allowing adults to talk, read, write about and practice sex without govt. approval, by allowing women to make medical decisons about their own bodies, etc. the right got up in arms and has stayed that way. Anyone who is not a commited religious zealot should understand and act politically on the knowledge that the right will never consider itself free from persecution until it can dictate how everyone will live; they will never be satisfied with less and compromise will acomplish nothing to solve the problem. Hopefully the Terry Schiavo fiasco has demonstrated this to people. If it didn't I don't know what it will take.
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Thank you for that
I didn't realize the ancestry of this assault on the First Amendment. The John Birch Society, and Ford's "The International Jew"? Whew.
It's also interesting to read, on the History Channel's website, that when we were undoubtedly a more "Christian" nation, you could celebrate the "traditional" English Christmas in Virginia, but if you had a yule log, figgy pudding and a wassail in pre-revolutionary Boston, it would cost you a five-shilling fine. So, in fact, the only assault on Christmas has come from other religions.
What these Babbits don't seem to realize is, the Christmas at Wal-Mart and the other frantic shopping malls are not a traditional Christmas, but one that has been hijacked by the proponents of commericalism. Before the Victorian era, Christmas was either a strictly religious day, or a time of drunkenness, kissing under mistletoe, and all kinds of hijinks. The letter from Wal-Mart, which got its author fired, is in fact true.
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Happy Holy Days & Merry Fundraising to All
Before Christ's Mass, this season of holy days was Saturnalia.
If this sort of foolishness is what it means to be a good Christian today, then the gods help us because the arenas may one day fill with new martyrs.
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bizzarre
I love how O'Reiley et. al. are up in arms about the lack of christianity in department stores somehow eroding their cultural identity as christians. Someone really needs to tell Bill and friends that it's patently absurd to claim that Walmart and other department stores have any bearing at all on their religion, or their freedom to practice it. Its a weird form of idolatry that allows you to mistake consumerism for the practice of your religion. Given that he can still go to mass, wish anyone he pleases a "Merry Christmas," decorate his home any way he pleases, and publicly celebrate the birth of christ, I honestly can't figure out what's crawled up his ass and died. What a fucking blowhard.
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Enough.
I am so sick of these people and their nutjob rhetoric.
War against Christmas? I don't think so.
Their war waged against everyone else? Their war demanding that everyone else in this country become a Christian and celebrate Christian holidays and shut their mouths about it and heaven (if you believe in it) forbid you speak up because that's certainly not what America is about...
...yeah, it's happening. And I, a Buddhist agnostic, am tired of it. Just shut up already.
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<shrug>
strange how a few reasonable complaints can explode into this type of conspiracy. These guys should meet everyone who thinks Israel & President Bush are responsible for 9/11.
When someone desecrates a Church around Christmas time, then I will start to care.
my main response to this article is , cry me a river
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Should we be arguing about whether the Grinch stole Christmas at all?
Ms. Goldberg's article about the ongoing "War On Christmas" as perceived by the so-called-Christian extremists, was at it's best as it portrayed the long and pathetic history of this right-wing polemic. I had never heard of the previous incarnations of this conspiracy against Christmas. However, are we wasting time discussing it? Are those who believe Mr. O'Reilly likely to read, or be influenced by this article, or are they listening to CD's of Bill?
The sad fact is, too few Liberals and Progressives, have read the Bible, and so are not well disposed to have an informed debate with these nitwits. Not that one could ever hope of winning. But winning the argument with the Right is not the issue, we need to convince the wobbly Middle. The fruit-studded jello that won't admit to being jello. We must stop responding to Moral arguments with Civil Rights arguments. The two ships pass in the dark. We need to respond to moral arguments with moral arguments.
As the hapless WalMart employee quite accurately stated, Christmas is a fabrication of all sorts of Non-Christian symbols. Moreover, as too many people know, but won't discuss, it's date is a fancy; it is not sanctioned by the Bible, it was not commanded by Jesus. Jesus, my dear Jerry, was a Jew, talking to Jews, trying to set Jews free from their religious burdens, to help them know God, personally; according to Christian Holy Books. Unfortunately, people prefer their religions to God, and the result was fairly unpleasant, and not at all successful. As the WalMart employee also discovered, The Truth may emanate from God, but The People prefer to kill those who speak the Truth. What would happen to Jerry Falwell if he instead sued all stores and merchants who sold secular merchandise under the guise of Christmas? If he denounced the Christmas Tree, and Christmas Presents? It would be the end of Jerry Falwell. Americans wouldn't have it.
But, instead, we are breathlessly reporting the cyclical re-emergence of this rightwing fantasy as confirmation of the lowly origins of the Right, while we steadfastly avoid any contact with the one book that would provide us with all the ammunition necesary, to not only sink the Godless Right, and bury them in primordial ooze so deep they'd never escape; we would also have a good chance at creating a truly free society, moral and just, in every way. And still have lots of room for good old fun, and dancing! And Wine!