These people are the enemy. The last thing young women need is some Jim Jones wannabe telling them to submit to their male partners or husbands. Thid dude, Driscoll, is a con and I hope that no matter how many free fences get built, people realize the price is too damn high.

>My heart goes out to the woman who put aside her life as a freewheeling, successful marketer to become a submissive Stepford wife baby-hatcher.<

Hers is an old, old story. Her problem is that she hasn't figured out _what_ she believes in and what to dedicate her life to. People who go from one extreme lifestyle to another are looking to the outside to tell them who they are instead of figuring it out themselves. It's a shame she's now thrown kids (that she doesn't want and obviously dislikes) into the mix. And rest assured her husband and her church will make sure she stays so busy breeding she'll never have a chance to find out who she is (which, of course, is the whole point of this kind of "women do nothing but have kids" stuff.)

Better watch out for that Cool-Aid!

Weird as hell. Totally pixallated. Strange American religio-freako bizzairity. Nutball. The perfect American goulash of cultish nonsense this time around flowing from the the empty faltulence of consummerism that has turned everything in the universe into a product, especially God. This is the result of human brains being formed in a total market culture. Kool-Aid line forming to the right.

If regressive and defensive behaviors reflect a threatening and disintegrating social environment, then Lauren’s take on the scope and spread of Mars Hill as ominous may be right on.

Religion evolved largely as means for a patriarchy to control behavior, especially the reproductive/sexual behavior of women, as Mars Hill is regressively recapitulating. Another primary function is to allow individuals to avoid moral development, that is to avoid the anxiety associated with moral choice. Mars Hill provides this escape from fear of choice – and the possible rejection by a group for non-conforming behavior – by establishing a strict moral code by authority. To some extent this is a feature of all religions, but what is remarkable is the stifling of autonomy in the Mars Hill age group.

The author’s characterization of church member Ted Dietz illustrates a basic psychological need served by Mars Hill, and the internal seed of its failure. Dietz’s choices and behaviors are clearly morally compromised: endangering others by running a red light, subjugating and mistreating others based on their gender or lack of conformity to his beliefs, disregarding social injustice (a Bush supporter). He defensively projects his own “tyranny” onto others. To protect himself from the resulting internal dissonance and anxiety, he constructs himself as moral entirely by virtue of his membership in the church, where he can go to be named “godly” by his pastor. Salvation not by works, but by symbolism alone.

As many letter-writers have noted, the Mars Hill phenomenon can be analyzed as fear-based, regressive, misogynist, not-for-us. OK, so what then?

We all have a need for relatedness and security, just as Mars Hill members do. Mars Hill helps us see that real community can never be based on fear, enforced conformity, need for control, or conditional acceptance. That is, never on religion but quite possibly on the ideals that religions destroy. Like Lennon said.

I know that Seattle equals espresso in many minds, but drive thru espresso stands certainly don't outnumber churches in Ballard 10:1. If anything, it's closer to the other way around. Historically, Ballard has had approximately equal numbers of bars and churches. (17 at one count) Depending on your limits for exactly what is Ballard, there are maybe two or three drive thru espresso places. Drive thrus tend to be a lot more common in suburbs and other places where there are more parking lots and fewer small businesses.

It's inaccuracies on the stuff that I know that make me wonder what fact checking was done on the parts that I don't have first hand knowlege of.

When I moved to Ballard two years ago, I was struck by the large number of churches here. There are at least 6 (inclucing one Buddhist temple) within a four block radius of my house. Sandler's observation that Ballard is a place where there are ten drive-through coffee stands for every church strains poetic license to the breaking point. In fact, I'd guess that the reverse is closer to the truth.

A niggling point perhaps, but coming at the beginning of the article it made me suspicious of the author's other "facts" and assertions.

And did Sandler really feel the slightest bit disappointed or offended at being excluded from knuckle-dragger Dietz's circle of sexist friends? She should have been rejoicing!

As for me, now that I know what's happening down the road, I think I'll hang out in front of Mars Hills Church next Sunday with a placard reading "When the Rapture Comes, Can I have Your Stuff?"

When I first read the line "The evangelical culture is rooted in place, and it's expanding every day to swallow a generation whole," I thought, great, an intolerant "liberal" view, and what's wrong with a growing Christian movement?

Then I read on. Of course, there is nothing wrong with a growing Christian movement. But the intolerance, basic lack of knowledge relating to how the various books of the Bible was written (as any Jew or Catholic with a religious education could tell you, which pretty much destroys the fundamentalist argument) and the debasemet of women is revolting.

And this was really unbelievable: "We have a really nice rapport. But we believe different things. And let's face it, because of that, you're never going to feel like family to me. So, what I'm saying is, this is as far as it goes." This is as un-Christian as a message gets. Ever hear of the Good Samaritan, Dietz? I don't even mean in terms of helping someone out. I mean that Samaritans were the most despised people of Jesus's time, and by painting the character as the kindest and most worth emulating, a message was being conveyed about how we are all brothers and sisters, whether we worship the same or not, and love should extend beyond the boundaries of any group-think mentality.

Awful to see the idea of Christian community used as a weapon against outsiders. Yes, I know hypocrisy isn't news, but familiarity has not made my heart grow fonder. I would place no trust in the people running this movement.