If ever one needed proof of Marx' old saw, this article provides it. As for those who throw around the word "tolerance", you are a bit confused. In the Reverand Driscoll's snide comment about the woman without children and the congregation's approving comments, the true face of these people come out. Sure when you meet them they are the nicest people in the world. Since they are trying to convert you so they put on a pretty face. Just listen to what they say about you among their own kind.

Anyone who believes I'm doomed to the hellfire if I don't think like them, can go to hell. I have as much tolerance for these people as I do for a heroin drug addict.

Having said that, I am a true believer in liberty. Liberty means the right to do what you want, including to fuck up your life in any way you see fit. Moreover as Benito Juarez so wisely said, "Peace is the respect of the rights of others" So if I support legalization of all drugs (which I do) I'm going to support the right of people to practice whatever religion they want in any way they see fit. That is, unless and until they violate Juarez' principle. Inevitably it seems, all fundamentalists groups do when given the chance, but "innocent until proven guilty" right?

secular society, in the beautiful metropolis of Detroit. For eighteen years I adhered to the strict moral code of my peers. "Do what we tell you to do, do what we do or you are not cool, and you can wander off and die for all we care". Do you not think that secular society is a cruel taskmaster? For the bulk of humanity, the societal religion they practice is cold, relentless, unforgiving, and worst of all utterly unsatisfying. I think that is why we are so subject to marketing. It is the religious dogma of today. Unsatisfied? Try the NEW 7-Up. It will make you feel better, make you accepted by the other "congregants", and as a plus, quench your thirst! If you think you are not subject to it, not a member of that church, you are fooling yourself.

What is considered stupid and ugly today, will become the glam of tomorrow. For those of you that think Christians are gullible, just remember how many times platform shoes have been alternately considered stylish and "must-have" or just corny and "to be disposed of". We all adhere to something. We all run our lives by some form of philosophy. Do you prefer the church of consumerism, of pride, of existentialism, where every peer is your "preacher", taskmaster, judge, and commiserant?

When I was eighteen, having been a good practitioner of the church of secular society, I decided that if there was no more than getting up, going to work, going to a club, getting drunk, going to bed (repeat until you die), then why bother. Fortunately I was introduced to a philosophy that did not "create" meaning for my life, rather it demonstrated that my life had always had meaning and purpose, and that I just wasn't practicing it. Of six kids in my family, all are divorced (some numerous times), one sister is in prison, and one sleeps on the streets. Yet, we are a typical family. My childhood best friend had to leave Detroit under threat of death, and now talks like the old man down the street that stays drunk all the time, because that's what he is. I found Jesus early in life, learned, internalized, and practice his teachings (not what someone told me to practice, rather what I read straight from the source -You can read, right?) to the best of my ability and with the help of that spirit which develops in anyone who seeks it. As a result I have been spared much of what my siblings, friends and a huge portion of society experienced due to their adherence to society's "cult".

I have learned that I am more than a bag of "electric meat". I have a beautiful family, a foundation from which to deny the taskmaster that is the world and society, and large group of like-minded friends. Do I still face issues? Of course. Do they rule or define my life? No.

Considering the alternative, do you really think that the members of the Mars Hill church have made a poor choice?

"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened. Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." - God

Poco

Again and again this article mentions TATTOOS as something that indicates a rebellious, free-thinking, unusual act -- where the hell have you guys been for the past uhh... 10 years? When I lived in Austin, a few friends of mine considered starting a VERY exclusive club for people aged 20-35 WITHOUT any FREAKIN' TATTOOS. What I'm saying is, it would have been a very tiny group of people INDEED. Jesus, now I live in one of the most conservative big cities in America, and when I go to yoga class, EVERY single goddamned one of these Bush-loving Tahoe-driving Coach-bag-carrying ex-sorority girls has got some Chinese proverb or Celtic scroll or butterfly or some such idiotic bullshit tattooed across their rapidly spreading 28-38-year-old arms or asses. "Pretty Lady" has become "Pretty Sad." (to quote the SNL tattoo removal commerical). When I see someone with a tattoo, I do not think, "Wow! What a REBEL!" I see someone who was unable to resist one of the stupidest FASHION TRENDS (and that's ALL it was or is) of the 90's. All I can say is, SHEEPLE! This article just reinforces my point.

"Listen," he says. "We have a really nice rapport. But we believe different things. And let's face it, because of that, you're never going to feel like family to me. So, what I'm saying is, this is as far as it goes."

And that, I believe, is the heart of the matter. This is where this group fails as a Christian endeavor. And it's why the majority of organized religions ultimately serve to separate us, rather than bring us together.

Of course, that also applies to class, race, gender, political movements, ethnicity - you name it. Any system, any classification, that the human mind can label, will have the same result.

So, in that sense, I don't see the members of Mars Hill Church as any more or less dangerous than any other group. And, as many other letter-writers have said, there doesn't appear to be anything that's really new about this group.

I will admit that, as a childless woman who doesn't belong to a church or believe in God (not a decision that I made lightly - it was years in the making), this article pushed a lot of buttons for me. I tried my best to stifle my reactive reflexes while reading.

I understand the need for this kind of feeling - of community, of being part of something larger than oneself. I've spent a lot of time on MySpace, and I've seen the profiles of hundreds of young people who want to make some kind of connection, who want to be seen as unique and special. I'm not a part of this generation (I'm in my 40's), but it seems to me that these young people have faced some pretty bleak formative years.

But, one has to wonder what their own children will feel, having been brought into the world for the sole purpose of replenishing the supply of Christians.