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Wednesday, September 13, 2006 12:00 AM

Come as you are

At Mars Hill Church in Seattle, Snoop Dogg figures in sermons, housewives cradle babies in tattooed arms -- and religious fundamentalism rules. Meet the Disciple Generation, the fierce new face of American evangelism.

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Wednesday, September 13, 2006 02:56 PM

Nope

The fact that this movement is so linked to jejune pop culture and trendy affectations is the reason why it's weak - and not strong at all. I'd be more impressed, in the way the author obviously intends, if the church was strong enough to wean these kids away from that stuff. The fact that it still has to cater to this approach is the reason why it just isn't that scary.

Wednesday, September 13, 2006 02:49 PM

It will peak then subside

"Grunge" evangelical Christianity, a la Mars Hill Church, smells to me like a fad. It's going to run out of steam before it can achieve much political traction.

For one, "grunge" Christianity appeals to young adults--who are absolutely notorious for "trying on" lifestyles, only to move on after a few years. The creed's anti-intellectual dogma and its followers' grooming affectations, generally, will strike us as dated in the not too distant future. For another, this stripe of Christianity is antifeminist, which is sooner or later going to spark the better instincts of its young female adherents. OK, you "trade" your independence for "security" and "family." What kind of deal is that, really?

Wednesday, September 13, 2006 02:47 PM

From the horse's mouth

I’m nothing short of furious that Ms. Sandler felt it was ok to pick & choose snippets of our conversation and weave them together to create a more controversial story. I write this, not so much to defend myself, but to defend my family who she’s dragging through the mud in the name of journalism.

First of all, yes, I admitted that there was a time when I did not want children. What she curiously chose to leave out of the article, is that once I got older and had a change of heart, my husband & I tried for almost a year to conceive our son. And during my pregnancy, I had a dangerous complication that threatened his life. My heart was breaking because I loved him so much – even before he was born. My faith in Jesus and my friends at Mars Hill (both women and men) were what kept me strong during the 88 days that I was in and out of the hospital on strict bed rest. Sure the kids drive me nuts sometimes, but why can’t I admit that without being accused of not wanting to be a mother??? Have any of you tried to do a two hour interview with someone while your 2 year old and newborn are vying for your attention? Yes, I was frustrated. Do I wish I didn’t have my children? Of course not. And this quote: "We had originally planned not to have kids, but now we have to do our best to repopulate our city with Christians" is insane.

Secondly, there is no reason for anyone to feel sorry for me. I am not a woman who has been put in a cage only to be let out for procreating and to fix dinner.

To suggest that I am at the effect of a misogynist husband and church is hilarious when you consider the real sexism that I experienced in the music industry as a single woman. I toured with a band once whose tour manager used to make jokes that I should play “bunk roulette” with the guys on the bus. I got kicked off a tour for the simple fact that I was a woman because the drummer’s girlfriend thought he’d hit on me. And I couldn’t go to a venue without local security guards assuming I was a groupie or that one of the guys in the band was my boyfriend.

I praise God for delivery me from that world and blessing me with a husband who loves me and treats me like gold.

So go ahead, believe what you will. I expect that none of this will change anyone’s mind about me, Mars Hill, or Jesus but I had a few things I wanted to get off my chest.

Wednesday, September 13, 2006 02:43 PM

Yeah, but the Amish don't scare me ...

I've read some the posts that compare the Mars Hill Cultists to the Amish.

The Amish?

You've gotta be kidding.

The Amish quietly live their throwback lives there in Lancaster, PA. They aren't attempting to breed an "anti-electricity majority" or trying to form Act 29-like cells around the country to increase the number of "pro-barn-raising volk" nationwide.

The Amish aren't going to screw with you or me. They're like England or France or Brazil--foreign, but not a threat. Sadly these Christian end-times nuts are closer in worldview and thus in threat potential to the "Islamofacists" we're told to be terrified of who embrace jihad as the only path to a restored Caliphate, overseeing a world united in worship of Allah. In other words, they both are jonesing for WWIII. Yikes!

Look, I sure hope when my biological body stops functioning somehow my consciousness will keep on going but I'm not betting on it, and I doubt that whether I believe in Yahweh, Allah, Jehovah, Jesus, Buddha, Zeus or Voodoo Man it is going to make much of a difference.

Sadly, that answer won't exactly cut it with end times nuts like the Mars Hillers or their emotional and intellectual doppelgangers in the Middle East.

When life gets challenging enough, economically, socially or environmentally, their kind will start doing god's work to separate the wheat from the chaff --with extreme prejudice -- just as they have for 2000 years through inquisition, pogrom or jihad, only this time they'll support leaders who will have nukes.

Who's ever left will either get to finally meet Jesus or Allah or Yahweh or Buddha or Voodoo Man --or they're going to be awfully pissed about having to live on a radioactive cinder all because like Charlie Brown's sister Sally, they believed Linus about the Great Pumpkin and missed out on Halloween.

Except in this case, "Missing Halloween" will actually be centuries of nuclear winter. Ouch.

Aggressive "People of faith" like this scare the hell out of me because they are like the evil party boss in Orwell's 1984, they won't rest until I and all the other Winstons like me absolutely BELIEVE that 2+2 equals five because Big Brother says so.

I'm not thrilled about dying. I'm sure religion helps some people deal with it. I just wish these "people of faith" all over the world could be more like the Amish and just leave everybody alone. Then they would be "like the Amish."

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