Letters to the Editor
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@Tara21
>I'll resist repeating what others have said: "Dump him, and then ask yourself why you let this happen."...There is nothing wrong with your self-esteem or your 'boundaries,' you're simply and normally and human-ly in love.<
But does being "in love" mean you let the other person deny you not only part of his space, but _your_ space, as well? Love is a two-way street, correct? It's supposed to make you feel (mostly) happy/content--and secure in the fact you have someone who at least has your best interests at heart...and vice-versa. This "love" is making the LW miserable, and she doesn't see that it's not love. That sounds like a definite problem with self-esteem/boundaries.
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Forget just giving you a key. He should be asking you to move in.
And if he's not ready for that, then he should be perfectly willing to put up with the situation of you living exclusively out of your own apartment.
He doesn't want more closeness with you. He just wants convenience. He knows giving you a key (or inviting you to move in) increases his commitment to you; that's why he won't do it.
Did he really say "That's okay, we just won't see each other as often"? I mean, come on, what does that tell you? Like Cary says, if he can get anything he wants by threatening to deprive you of seeing him (and furthermore, if that arrangement wouldn't bother him in the least), then the things that are broken here cannot be fixed with a key. Or even a key and flowers and a teddy bear.
You guys need to have a serious talk about what each of you wants from the relationship. I think you might find that they don't match up very well.
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Okay, I think some of the posters are getting it all wrong...
I don't think that boyfriend is an @sshole or has serious issues. I think he's a regular guy who clearly has a busy life with a job that requires that he be on the road or in the air a bit.
This is about the girlfriend. She doesn't know how to take care of herself and not inconvenience herself in a DATING relationship.
BF shouldn't have to give up a key if he doesn't want to. GF should take a hint! He likes her, he wants to date her, but he doesn't want to live with her.
They could have been dating for 6 months. We don't know. If they'd been dating for only 3 months would you suddenly get his POV? But even if it were 6 months or a year is not marriage. Personally I think that you should only trade keys after being engaged. I personally have rarely enjoyed having the responsibility of a key. He's out of town and I have a key so he wants me to water plants and feed dogs and pick up mail suddenly? I have free time and the cable guy is coming, so can I sit and wait for the visit SINCE I HAVE A KEY?! Yeesh!
It's an overrated relationship milestone. And I think that the issue is way on GF's part, not his. Dating is only an inconvenience to those who want something more.
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@AfroGoddess, you missed a point here...
LW said (see underlined part below):
>If he needed to fly out to Kansas for two days, I would basically have to pack a bag of my essentials because I couldn't have access to them if he was not around to open the door. It got ridiculous. _So I took all of my things back, and said that I need to "live out of" my own place. But he did not like that, either._<
Boyfriend didn't want LW to live out of _her_ own place, either, even though that would be the sensible (and convenient) thing. He wants her at his beck and call; to have all the convenience while she has none. It's not about her being "pushy"--it's about him wanting all the marbles.
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@ deering
Yeh, I get what you're saying, I agree. What I was trying to convey was that, when we get our hearts broken too often there's a whole raft of pop psychologists ready to tell us why we were idiots to let it happen in the first place.
My feeling is that the LW is rather young, and ya know no one teaches you how to conduct relationships, etc, and it can be confusing at first when you're just trying to sort things thru and do the best you can.
None of us is perfect, and my bet is that there are loads of people in fully functional relationships who have poor self-esteem, lack of boundaries, etc -- somehow they just bump along together.
I hope I'm expressing this right -- i think our culture has come very far away from the idea of 'self-sacrifice' and 'be the first to say you're sorry' in relationships in favor of "When you're in love, make sure all your needs are met! Make sure the guy is perfect, otherwise, YOU DESERVE MORE!"
Deering, again, I agree about people having the right boundaries, etc, I just think there is too much emphasis these days on people undergoing a complete psychological overhaul when relationships end, as tho there were something dreadfully wrong with them.
(hope I explained that right...)
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@undertheradar
writes:
"I'm afraid you are completely missing the point. It's not about him not being ready and she's pushing him into commitment- because HE is already pushing HER into commitment but refuses to to treat her like a partner."
I don't see that as a fact.
LW writes:
"He still will not give me a key, and HE INSISTS that I continue to LIVE OUT OF A BAG."
OK, what exactly does this mean?
LW has her own place and her own stuff, yet says: "I do not want to be there when he is not there, but I spend a lot of time there between work and school."
So is he always there when she's there, or not?
LW: "He tells me to bring my things so that I can sleep over and then get ready for work at his place. I go over there all the time and stay there. I had a closet for clothes and a bathroom closet. But the more I made myself comfortable, the more often I would need to get into his place to get things: makeup, a suit, a book, a pair of sneakers. It became very inconvenient, not having a key."
Sounds to me like she was moving in, a little at a time. So much of her stuff was at BF's place that she couldn't function without access.
LW: "It got ridiculous. So I took all of my things back, and said that I need to "live out of" my own place. But he did not like that, either."
"He wants me to stay at his place, but pack a DIFFERENT BAG EACH TIME so that I never need to go inside without HIM OPENING THE DOOR. (my bolds.)"
"That's just batshit crazy."
No, it's just dumb. BF needs to learn about natural consequences: if he wants LW to be around a lot and have her stuff at his place, she needs access in the form of a key. And she will give him a key to her place too.
If BF doesn't want to give LW a key, she won't be around so much because it's not practical for her.
LW did the right thing getting her stuff out of there.
"I'm sorry, Jug, but this is bullshit."
We don't know how long LW and BF have been together, how old they are, how serious they are, how much relationship experience they have, who is pushing whom to do what how soon, etc.
In any relationship, both parties have to know how to set limits and say no clearly. And to learn they cannot have their cake and eat it too. It seems to me that both BF and LW
need a big bite of a reality hoagie.
"You don't tell someone that they need to live out of a bag just to be with you."
Agreed - but is BF really saying that? Is he saying he'll break up if LW doesn't do it his way? Or is he just saying
what he'd like her to do, and she needs to just say no because
it's too hard on her?
"If he is inviting her over, and telling her to bring her stuff, AND telling her that it's not acceptable for her to live at her OWN place, then she needs a damn key so she can USE her own stuff."
Is that what he's really saying? If so, then the crazy part is saying it's not acceptable for her to live at her own place, not that she can't have a key to his place. He cannot demand what he won't accept; doing so is the definition of a double standard.
"If he's "not ready" for the implied commitment of a key, then he needs to let her operate out of her own apartment sans ultimatums about seeing her less if she does."
It's not a question of what he "lets her" do. He's not her boss, she's not his. As long as they have separate places, they have the right to be masters of their own domiciles.
What Cary wrote, and what I agree with, is to not protect BF from the natural consequences of his choices. No key means
she's around less, because she doesn't have the time, and is
living out of her own place, not a bag.
That's all.
If he doesn't like it, tough cookies, that's the price of not
giving her a key nor spending time at her place.
Don't dump him just because he won't give up a key, but don't enable unreasonable double-standard behavior, either.
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What I find curious is the readiness some folks have to make hard and fast judgements on so little factual information.