Letters to the Editor
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Read John the riot act
LW, if you truly love your wife, and if you think she truly loves you but has a weakness for this guy John, do this: get John alone somewhere. Tell him to stay away from your wife. Tell him that you'll rip his balls off and shove them down his throat if he doesn't stay away from her. Scare him.
Do this where nobody else can hear you, so you can deny everything.
Violence is a crude tool, but effective. Threats of violence can be just as effective.
John is in the wrong, absolutely and completely. Don't feel bad about scaring the piss out of him. If you have a good friend, preferably big and scary, bring him along. Do this, and John will go away and pester someone else's wife.
Good luck, dude.
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Dude...
...you are a masochist; she's a sadist...and the emotional content of your marriage apparently is mostly about her jerking your chain. What is there you love about this woman? Is it worth the mess she puts you through?
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Oh, brother
You are married to a serial cheater. Sex or no sex, it's not really relevant. D-I-V-O-R-C-E is the answer.
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The definition of insanity...
...is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
1. You knew that she had carried on an emotional affair with her first husband, and that it deeply hurt him.
2. You knew that the chase was more attractive than the catch for her, because once she was free and clear to pursue Bill, she didn't.
3. You knew that she had an emotional affair during marriage No. 2, and
4. You knew that she was trying to manipulate her way out of having said so.
5. You have been monitoring your wife's phone habits on and off for TEN YEARS.
6. You have evidence that there is another emotional affair going on, and
7. You are witnessing her trying to manipulate her way out of admitting that.
8. Her offering in working on your marriage is to retain her "friendship" with John. That is what she is willing to bring to the table to try to make your marriage a healthy one.
What is it, exactly, that you are looking for in a relationship? A lab rat that you can observe from afar? What have you gotten out of the last ten years of your marriage? Are you going to write a dissertation on the correlation between your phone bill and the frequency of your fights? Who gives a shit? Your life is passing you by while you choose to remain stuck in these manipulative control games.
You have some major tunnel vision going on. Get some space and clear your head, if not for your own sake, then for the sake of your children who are going to grow up thinking that love means getting to the phone bill before their partner does.
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Dear Mr. Green -
She can't handle intimacy with you, is why she rambles around. You neither, with her; though you would claim, perhaps loudly, that you want nothing more than that. I can tell you don't because you are totally centered on her and have no interest in your life and your being. See, one can only get as close to someone else as they can get to themselves.
I don't know what to recommend, but this may be a start.
I like to be with people who like to be with me.
Best,
(More, for free: google "Rabid Fanatic" +"Monty Johnston")
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You're both crazy, but think of your daughter
You and your wife seem to deserve each other, and I can see that having you together keeps a lot of other healthy people from accidentally hooking up with either of you. But what kind of example are you setting for your child? Do you think she isn't beginning to catch on to Mommy's 'shopping trips' and phone calls?
Get a different therapist, or a spine transplant, and create the kind of life that will be a good example to your daughter. Divorced and healthy beats married and crazy, unless you both buy into the craziness. Your wife will never change because she doesn't think she's doing anything wrong. You realize now this isn't working, so now you really have no choice but to deal with it. The veils that gave the illusion of beauty and mystery have fallen to the floor, revealing the sick and tawdry situation you have accepted for too long. You can pick up the veils, but you'll aways remember what you've seen -- and that changes everything.
Good luck.
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It's familiar
Dear LW, If you were single and someone asked you what you were looking for in a marriage partner, would you list the following qualities? Someone who is:
1. Manipulative
2. Deceptive
3. A liar
4. And someone who asks for a divorce every few years
If I were you, I would use your connections to find a good therapist, and look at your relationship with your parents when you were growing up. You are reenacting something that is very sick, but is obviously very familiar to you.
I don't buy Cary's sentiments about this being the madness of "love." This is just madness; this is not love. If you didn't have love growing up, then you probably don't know what it is. Get a therapist to help you learn about love. Best of luck to you both.
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I was your wife
Dear LW
Lots of people will write in and say, dump her, she’ll never change. I will share my story with you because it offers hope but only a realistic brand.
First – I think that your wife has had sexual affairs. She is only copping to what she has to cop to because she got caught. But men rarely if ever settle for mere emotional affairs with a woman who meets your wife’s description. In all the affairs I had (about 10 in an 18 year marriage), I never once made the first move. You could describe me in words similar to those you used to describe your wife. Men have always been drawn to me. They always made the first move. I just went along for the ride, enjoying the attention, enjoying being desired enjoying that they did all the heavy lifting (finding the places, buying me gifts, sending me messages) while I pretty much bopped along on my way, soaking it all up as if I were entitled to it.
I almost got caught by my husband two different times. Each time I copped to what I had to cop to so that my husband would believe me and not suspect more. (Now I realize that he probably did, on some level, suspect more, but preferred to not question me unless I gave him a reason to, which usually I did not).
But once I got caught by others. They couldn't prove anything an I wriggled out of it, and my husband believed me, but it scared me. I vowed, never again. I loved my husband. He’s a really great guy. What I was doing had nothing at all to do with him. Isn’t that horrible to say? It’s the worst truth to have to face when you are the one being cheated on – that it’s not about you at all. You are so totally not present in the affair and it’s reasons for being (don’t believe it that the cheated on always has responsibility for an affair – that Is not true.) I just didn’t think about my husband at all. I compartmentalized like a champion.
Then after making this vow I embarked on a 2 year affair. And after that, another long-term affair that eventually ended my marriage.
Then I got caught again. Again, I lied, and copped to a lesser crime. My husband believed me and wanted to stay together. But all that cheating had taken it's toll - on me, not him. The guilt became overwhelming. I couldn't stop thinking how he deserved better than me. I couldn't face the shame of all my indiscretions. I had to leave the marriage, and hurt him again.
I went to a therapist. She is the first and only person I’ve told about my past. – all of it. It was unbelievably humiliating to admit to it. And then I set about doing the hard work to find out why I did something that went to counter to my values, my love for a good man, and my own self-respect. And after 3 years, I think I have a pretty good handle on the why. I also know that I will not do this again – ever. I am living consciously now, no longer a slave to deeply buried needs and automatic responses. I am through trying to solve the problems of my past with subterfuge with a man. I am done sexualizing the attentions of man. I no longer 'need' to be desired and adored at the expense of true emotional connection and real emotional honesty.
So a cheater can change. But the cheater has to really want to change, and I’m sorry to say, your wife doesn’t seem to want to. She can't even be honest - I dont' believe for a second there hasn't been any sexual indiscretions.
Your wife has a problem that will not be fixed until a) she recognizes it is a problem and b) she feels enough shame about the mismatch between her values and her actions to want to change.
So if you want advice, here is mine: If you love her, and can stay with her despite catching her in flagrante delicto, then hire a PI. Get the evidence. During this time, go to John and threaten to beat the living crap out of him if he doesn’t stay away from your wife. He’ll probably start backing away from her, which will cause her to be even more aggressive – both with him, and his replacement (there will be a replacement – there will always be a replacement). When you finally confront her with the evidence, tell her she has a choice – tell you the whole truth, all of it,unvarnished, from the beginning of your marriage. If she can't do that, then she loses you and the kids. Give her a week to think it over, with a ceasefire on contacting the other men in her life (keep the PI assigned).
This is what you do, all of the above, if you want to stay married. But in my view you probably should not want to stay married. How can you really be happy with this person who has no respect for you, who constantly lies to you, deceives you, and manipulates you? Face it - it’s not * John’s * face you really want to punch in – he’s just the current stand-in. If I were you, knowing what I know about your wife, I’d recommend a quick and bloodless divorce. I’d like to think she will admit to everything and show she is willing to do what it takes to change. But I think it will just be too much for her to admit to. I’m sorry for you, and I hope that you find happiness.