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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
The idea that a woman can easily find sex with the man of her choice is a false one. Period. It is also true that indiscriminate sex can be dangerous to a woman, so that's one reason why she may not engage in it. I can anticipate that if she's willing to take that risk, she can have sex. Ah, but that's like saying that we all have access to hundreds of thousands of dollars -- because one can always rob a bank. Yeah, it's risky, but it's an opportunity.
IMO men do have advantages when it come to indiscriminate sex. There's no social mandate for purity -- in fact, society encourages male promiscuity. There are fewer physical risks (that he'll be beaten/killed by his female lover). A man can evade the consequences of pregnancy. He can go to more places alone without comment. There are a host of advantages.
I don't get the point of this particular sub-topic that often is brought up by men who feel that they aren't getting their fair share of women, and that the women are denying them unjustly.
but men no longer have the means to force women to consider a point of view different from the one they already hold or face consequences which the women find compelling, whereas women do have the means (sex) to compel men to engage in a meaningful way with the way women see things or face consequences that matter.
but men no longer have the means to force women to consider a point of view different from the one they already hold or face consequences which the women find compelling, whereas women do have the means (sex) to compel men to engage in a meaningful way with the way women see things or face consequences that matter.
Well, it seems that the BF does in fact have the means to FORCE LW to consider a different pov...and his approach is far nastier than a woman using sex to get her man's "meaningful" attention.
But just out of curiosity, anon, if you could employ "means" to get a woman to see things from your pov, what would those "means" be?
"I don't get the point of this particular sub-topic that often is brought up by men who feel that they aren't getting their fair share of women, and that the women are denying them unjustly."
There's no point to get, other than some men prefer to bitch and moan and play the victim and blame others for their problems instead of taking responsibility for their problems and addressing them (just as some women do).
Ok, ONE man felt the need to apologize for other men's behavior. ONE.
If your point is that men have to convince women to like them (are the pursuers) whereas women are the pursued and can pick and choose, let me just point out that the social structure of our society was devised by men.
Furthermore, if you think it is so horrible to have to prove to women that you are worthy of them, would you like instead to have to field aggressive come-ons from men constantly? To be afraid to walk alone at night because you've had obviously drunk, scary men approach you and follow you home? To not feel at liberty to take advantage of the copious opportunities you believe women have because, as someone else pointed out, you have a legitimate fear of being raped or hurt?
You seem to be upset that women have enough power nowadays that men actually have to make themselves seem palatable to us. You seem to think that the fact that relationships nowadays, in some places at least, are based on mutuality means that we're under the sway of "female supremacists". This is just women getting the same basic rights as human beings as men have had for a long time. I can choose who not to sleep with. That, as far as I'm concerned, is a basic human right.
If I don't want to sleep with you (and I emphatically don't, by the way), there is no negotiation involved. There is no alternate view point to consider. When you're talking about sex, there are points of view to consider: does each person want to sleep with the other? If one does and the other doesn't, the one who doesn't wins, because no one can be (or ought to be) compelled to sleep with someone he/she doesn't want to. End of story. It may be that it is more often the man who wants to and the woman who doesn't, but that isn't some huge conspiracy of female supremacists, that's just each of us, individually, exercising our right to our bodies.
You said: "what I meant was more that lots of men apparently feel that men owe women an apology for other men's failure to socially/sexually/emotionally please women, but women don't feel they owe men an apolgy for the fact that women don't always do what men want in social/sexual matters."
I am NEVER going to apologize to any man for any woman not doing what he wants in sexual matters. We are not property. A person, whether male or female, should NEVER be compelled to do anything sexual he/she does not want to do. That is not something to apologize for. Since your only complaint seems to be that we don't sleep with you, you have not raised anything that one of us could apologize for.
And, finally, seriously, I don't mean this as a put-down, but rather as real advice: the way you have talked about sex here, as some sort of contest or power struggle between the sexes, might have a lot to do with why more women aren't lining up to sleep with you.
the issue is whether in a modern civilized society, functioning according to the rules everyone agrees should apply (and again I am well aware that this is not always, to put it mildly, the case), women are willing to seriously consider the point of view of men when it conflicts with their own emotions in a way equivalent to what men are willing to try to do to try to get along with women. I think the answer is obvious and becoming more so by the minute.
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