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Wednesday, November 15, 2006 12:00 AM

I'm a student in Scandinavia terrified of rape

I'm starting to see attackers behind every bush. Am I being silly and paranoid?

The letters thread is now closed.

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Wednesday, November 15, 2006 05:01 PM

Nick

Nick, suppose that you decide, as you to seem to consider later in your post, that Muslims really do pose a threat to people in their everyday lives. In the the face of the evidence just on this threat, will you apologize to the original letter writer for the personal attacks on her in your first sentences? It is rare to see a letter from an Islam apologist contradict itself within the space of two paragraphs, but you and your low rent Garrison Keillor imitation seem to have done the trick.

Wednesday, November 15, 2006 05:00 PM

Muslim Justice, Re. Rape

I would direct those who feel that it's sheer prejudice to implicate some religious faiths for not taking a negative stance toward sexual assault to look to the decision by the Pakistani government, announced just today -- that rape victims there may have a pass past Islamic law which dictates that rape victims must produce four witnesses (here, it's called gang rape) and still face punishment themselves. Some progress.

Also, I am still befuddled by those who choose to express strong positions but avoid stating their names. How is it that you feel this way, but do it anonymously?

Wednesday, November 15, 2006 04:27 PM

Yeesh

Yes, that letter was horrifying for its easy adaptation of absurd stereotypes regarding ethnic groups and rape. It seems to be the product of Prohibition-era, "Reefer Madness"-style demagoguery of the worst sort. The mind is what it is, LW bears no shame for her fears, however irrational, but overcoming them would help her to become something better than she is. I hope that she aspires to that, and will one day manage to overcome her fear and see people as individuals and not caricatures. Yes, some martial arts or self-defense training would be a good idea, as others have suggested. If if she doesn't become proficient in any discipline, it does help to train the mind, sharpen the senses and reform one's attitude and outlook. She would be gain greater mastery of her environment, wherever she went, and the confidence gained would be evident to others, as well. Throw out anything with "aero" or "cardio" in the name, it's automatically useless as far as real world applications go. Krav Maga, yes. Shotokan or Seido, yes. Sambo, by all means, yes. Aikido and jujitsu would also be fine. Basically, anything with a decided emphasis on striking, grappling and escape. Kickboxing styles, Tae Kwon Do and capoeira are all too technical and obsessed with aesthetics, and are thus a waste of time IMHO, certainly relative to the former.

What I have to wonder, though, given what other respondents have written here, is whether she isn't in fact irrational? Is it really _that_ _bad_ over there now? Are women in Scandinavian cities actually verbally or physically accosted by Muslims on a daily basis? It just sounds so insane I can hardly believe it. It may well be true, but it's just so far from anything in my experience, it sounds like it must be hysteria. No place I've ever lived or visited for a significant amount of time, no matter where, could ever be the setting of such occurrences on a daily basis. Once or twice, sure, anything can happen, anywhere, but as an institutionalized practice? Where are your men? Are they so neutered by modern mores that they stand idly by and watch this type of shit happen? And here I was actively considering converting to Asatru, so much for that. I would undergo a Bixby-to-Ferrigno-style transformation in about a nanosecond if I saw something like that happen. Far be it from me to quote J.S. Mill, but here I go anyway: "A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." Even in the quaintly progressive Northwoods villages in which I was raised, such a state of affairs would be totally incomprehensible. Oh, it may well have ended badly, with blood and tears and judgments and state supervision or some such (though I seriously doubt a jury of fellow burghers would ever impose a serious penalty for the defense of one's mother, wife or sister....or even a stranger), but that behavior would not have stood. I don't know, I have never been to Europe (unless you count Istanbul) and thus have no idea of the conditions. Can tolerance truly be this oppressive? Yeesh.

Wednesday, November 15, 2006 04:22 PM

KStone

I saw you on this thread, and figured you'd correct me if the article I referenced about the leader of Australian's Muslims had already been posted.

I think the letter writer has a legitimate concern, if she is forced to be close to Muslims. Europe has become a haven for them, and they are starting to feel their strength, especially in the face of the vacillating weakness of many Europeans. I found the letters on this thread from people who have experience dealing with Muslims to be particularly illuminating, don't you?

Golden Boy

PS See, I told you we were going to win on Tuesday! It's been a good week.....

Wednesday, November 15, 2006 04:08 PM

Re: "KStone, help me out here"

Golden Boy,

Huh? Help you out with what? Are you responding to my letter, which itself was a response to a tangental issue rasied by another person, or are you asking me to "help" with your view on this matter?

I'm not sure what help I could give you since you seem to have a...umm...predetermined...opinion when it comes to all things relating to Muslims.

So, I'd imagine your view is set but I could be wrong.

Wednesday, November 15, 2006 03:55 PM

KStone, help me out here

This is very interesting set of letters, which roughly fall into three categories:

1) You poor paranoid girl, let's find a way to make you more confident

2) She's right to be worried, Muslims are increasingly bold in their attacks on Westerners daring to live by Western rules in the West

3) She's racist and so is Cary, Muslims are not the issue.

What's even more interesting is that people posting along the lines of #2, in many cases, have extensive personal knowledge of the situation, gained by living in close proximity to Muslims. Posters in category #3, however, either live in a fantasy world or (like the notorious basbleu) are active apologists for Islam.

I'm hoping my old pal KStone will help me out here, since I admit I did not read every letter, but if this hasn't been posted before, I highly recommend it: http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/2006/10/27/rape/index.html. It's an article from Salon's broadsheet which records the public teachings of the top Muslim cleric in Australia. This mainstream Muslim leader compared unveiled women to "uncovered meat" and suggested taht raped women had it coming. Note that the reference is to all women, not just Muslims.

Perhaps the original letter writer has a legitimate concern?

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