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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
"Do you think women would show as much restraint . . ."
Let's assume that several things are true. Let's assume that you're right and women are fantastically unfair and irrational and want to manipulate men and also don't want them to cheat and let's assume that I think that is okay. Just for a second.
Why are you bothering with women then? Go on! Take your destiny into your own hands. You are the master of your own domain!
Let's also assume that these poor, poor men, shackled as they are to such inherently dishonest women, by rights DESERVE sex. It's not, as Tennis stated, a gift conjured from desire and compassion. It's just, you know, well, it's like rent. The woman has to ante up or she is "withholding". (Which implies that sex is located within a woman's body, an interesting idea considering that every man I know is a veritable professional at masturbation, but I guess that's somehow inadequate.)
This is a crap attitude and most women with an atom self-respect would not be turned on by such specious logic. If you come to the marriage table with that attitude you're not going to get much of anything, particularly not passion.
All love is a request. And any genuine notion of supplication comes with the implicit idea that you can refuse it.
You are so immersed in the beliief in the righness of a completely different standard for men than for women that you don't even recognize it's existence and therfore apparently believe that the statement that it does exist must really be about something else.
I just want to say that reading these letters makes me feel rather grateful that I never had any luck with the Salon Personals.
"There are women who think they are always right and their husband is some hapless boob so he better do what she says or he won't get any action. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a wife treat her husband like a child. To ignore this and pretend that it stems from mans lack of sexual ability and not some spoiled princess complex or thinly veiled man hate is shitty."
This is certainly true. There ARE women who disrespect their husbands, and that's not right, although I'm not at all convinced that this couple lands squarely in that category and there's nothing in the letter that implies that. Even if she said, "I'm never having sex with you again!" in the heat of an argument, he certainly never claimed to be innocent in the arguing, only that he wanted to "win" the argument. I would argue, as Mary Wollstencraft first hypothesized, that a lot of these manipulating behaviors come from feelings of helplessness. Many women spend their entire marriages being managed and handled by men who, after entering into holy matrimony with a woman, try to avoid relating to their wives on any level. Clearly it's a bad dynamic for both parties. But I don't think it's one-sided. I'm sympathetic to the men only to the degree that they are actually attempting to relate to their wives and have no sympathy at all from the opposite side of this man's own equation. He capitulates his point so he can get laid. That's hardly honorable. There's no mention of loving his wife or anything resembling true sympathy. He's just going along to get some. That, in and of itself, probably describes why his wife is so often angry at him. She knows that that's the only reason he relents and she feels awful. I can see why that makes them both look bad, but come ON! Why is it all on her?
"...I would argue, as Mary Wollstencraft first hypothesized, that a lot of these manipulating behaviors come from feelings of helplessness. Many women spend their entire marriages being managed and handled by men who, after entering into holy matrimony with a woman, try to avoid relating to their wives on any level...."
-- drinkwater
Drinkwater,
Could you try to construct a branch of feminist "thought" that doesn't reduce to:
Men act bad because men are evil
Woman act bad because men have treated them badly?
Maybe it's a little more elaborate:
1. Women are victims
2. Men are oppressors
Therefore: All oppression and wrong, and and all victims are women, and if it looks to be the other way around, you're just not looking deep enough.
You are correct that we don't know the woman's side of this story, and are judging her somewhat unfairly. But, when you hear of a man who "doesn't help out around the house enough," are you eager to ask how time-consuming and stressful is his job is relative to hers? If a woman complains that her husband "Doesn't compliment my appearance enough any more," do you ask how much weight she's gained during the marriage? Judging the other spouse in absentia is an inherent characteristic of this type of column.
If the person chooses to stay it's then a mutual decision, but if you don't openly offer a sexless relationship then it's YOUR job to figure out how to like sleeping with your partner or call it off.
Quite simply put the following are true, more often than not:
1. Women prefer to marry men who make more money than they do.
2. Women marry for security 1st and love a distant 2nd.
3. Marriage benefits women more than men.
4. Sex is better before you are married since most women feel that since they have "wrangled a man" they don't need to be as much of an active participant any more.
5. Most women use sex, children and money as a weapon since they are acutely aware that the family law court system is predisposed toward their favor.
6. Most women crow for equality but are unwilling to make those sacrifices necessary for such an event to occur.
7. There is no such thing as a "superwoman" who is a career person and a mother since the children are typically raised in a latchkey daycare setting or by nannies while the mother takes credit for how well they turned out or blames their father for how poorly they turned out.
8. Most women default on child support payments whereas most men pay their child support.
I could go on but the issues are very simple. There is no incentive for a man to marry unless you intend to have children and, in that event, it is wise to enter into a prenuptial agreement regardless of your income and to obtain the agreement no less than six months prior to marriage and to videotape it to validate that all parties were willing participants. If, as a man, you wish to give up more than 1/2 your assets when divorced and pay alimony then by all means don't do a prenuptial agreement. If a woman truly loves you she will enter into a prenuptial agreement, obviously in the interest of equality of the sexes and fairness, of course (facetious sigh here). In such an agreement you may put weight clauses, how many times per week you have sex, asset distribution, philandering clauses, etc. Over 50% of all 1st marriages fail and women file in over 75% of those divorces. Over 65% of all 2nd marriages fail. Statistics don't lie and marriage, by definition, is the formation of a corporation whose assest distribution upon dissolution is enforceable by the state, unlike any other company. You are forming a business. Treat it as such. Bear in mind that most women do treat it as a business. Also remember, if the State is willing to give joint custody of the children to a woman who murdered her husband (the children's father) in a premeditated attack and who received 20 years in prison for such an attack, anything is possible and likely to happen to a man's disadvantage (See Dr. Clara Harris in Texas who ran over her husband 3-4 times).
Much of the initial coverage about Fort Hood turned out to be wrong. Is there anything wrong with that?
The accountability imposed by another country for the CIA's kidnapping and torture reveals much about our own.
Fox News' morning show plays to type, talking about whether Muslims in the Army should face "special debriefings"
219 Democrats and one Republican join in favor of the legislation, which passed by a narrow margin
The survivor and author is upset about comparisons some on the right are making to genocide
Salon headlines in your mailbox
