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Sunday, Nov 8, 2009
Cary forgot tomention or even think about a very serious issue:namely the fact that most women are not particularly satisfied by "normal sex". the man asking him for advice forgot to mention whether when the sexual intercourse occurs, he is even trying to satisfy his wife and provide her with satisfaction.
And Cary took the bait hook,line and sinker.
The truth is that most men know abolutely nothing about satisfying a woman, nor do they care. The other sad truth is that the wife is seen as being somekind of an appliance, ready to serve her partner at any opportunity and to hell with her wishes or her desires.
Of course nothing is said about whether the sexual relatioship has changed after the marriage. Whether maybe the reason why the wife would refuse to have sex with her husbandis because he is not good at having sex ( as far as a woman's satisfaction goes) or too selfish to care. These points are not even remotely touched by Cary- for whom the woman appears to have to be just a happy slave, nor the author of the letter, who would have mentioned it if he would have cared.
How about those reasons, dear Cary- ever thought about a woman's satisfaction??
I don't buy this unsatisfied wife bullshit. Whenever issues like this come up the women always revert to the selfish husband argument. Are you women not capable of saying "Hey, this ain't working for me?" The "selfish husband" will more than likely try to do better if it means more sex for him. And if not, why the fuck are you married to him in the first place!? If it's ignorance on his part then TELL HIM HOW TO DO IT RIGHT! Stop blaming men for your inability to speak the fuck up and say something. If your husband/boyfriend refuses to improve then dump him!
Anywho, good advice on the part of Cary. Any model which doesn't come with no-strings-attached-sex needs to be returned, pronto (same goes for women who have men who are manipulative little shits).
To extract that as the central point of what is happening in this situation confirms the most extreme view possible of female self centerdness(and the male enablers of it). Why be in a relationship with someone who doesn't like you enought to sleep with you voluntarily, especially if you don't care. Frankly a non depressed man who is capable but won't pressure her seems like he would have no trouble in the dating world. Unless women would be wary of a guy who they couldn't influence in this way. So don't tell them.
To extract that as the central point of what is happening in this situation confirms the most extreme view possible of female self centerdness(and the male enablers of it). Why be in a relationship with someone who doesn't like you enought to sleep with you voluntarily, especially if you don't care. Frankly a non depressed man who is capable but won't pressure her seems like he would have no trouble in the dating world. Unless women would be wary of a guy who they couldn't influence in this way. So don't tell them.
Wow. A real pot-stirrer, this letter. Perhaps predictably, the responses segregate into two camps: "Stupid jerk!" versus "Evil bitch!" Distortion, anyone? The couple apparently had a good sex life in the past, so I'm guessing he's not a selfish klutz, and she's not frigid.
Things changed when they got married, and now the wife appears to be using sex as a commodity rather than an expression of affection or a thing to be enjoyed in itself; still, we don't know very much about this couple. For instance, How old are the kids? Do they sleep through the night? Do they pound at their parents' door? Are both parents happy with the division of labor, money, and time? Maybe LW isn't the only one with depression, itself a potential mood-killer.
Cary is correct, IMHO, about the repressed anger component of depression. This man is pretty angry with his wife; would it be any wonder if she were as repressed-but-angry at him? Especially if their expectations of each other have shifted from lover to spouse-and-co-parent unaknowledged. So maybe the wife only feels sexual towards him when she feels appreciated in her role as his wife and the mother of his children - hence the appearance of tit-for-tat. A recent item in Salon quotes a husband with words to this effect: (http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/01). Maybe winning an argument with him makes her feel engaged as an equal, and maybe she really needs that as the mother of young children. There’s bound to be truth in LW’s sense that he’s been manipulated. But there must also be another side to the story.
In any event, LW and his wife need to talk. Probably in the presence of a trained professional. They loved each other when they got married; the fact that they now find themselves in a rut-less rut need not be the end of the marriage.
It sounds like the wife is a selfish, controlling person who wants him to stop taking a medication that is obviously helping him greatly simply so that she can regain her previous control over the relationship.
Why else hardly ever have sex, primarily use it as a bargaining and emotional lever, then make a big fuss when the other party loses interest?
It is no simple trick to find a medication that will help someone's depression as much as he has been helped by Celexa...speaking from experience. Since she claims her feelings about sex have changed, it sounds like she knew good and well that she was unfairly manipulating the husband and now is scrambling to mop up. Can she be sincere? Maybe. But even if she is, the issue remains that she is probably a pretty screwy person to have done that kind of crap in the first place, and often people don't change much even when they want to.
If I were the LW, I would stay on the medication that is helping me so much, and use my new mental/emotional clarity and lack of interest in sex to seriously examine my feelings about the relationship. It appeared that there wasn't much to the marriage besides the occasional sex for the LW, and it's quite possible that he would be much better off away from his wife. If children are involved, of course that also requires consideration - but it sounds to me that he has discovered that there really isn't anything there worth having.
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