Letters to the Editor
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Let's make a pact
The previous Anon. was right. This totally turned into an "all about BrightStar" thing, which is exactly why he behaves the way he does. Negative attention is worse than no attention...
Can we all agree to COMPLETELY ignore him, unless he says something actually worth responding to? Oh wait, he hasn't yet, and never will so let's just completely ignore him, period. Full stop.
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brightstar65 on me posting more
Amity, please post more. You are a voice of reason in a wilderness of man-hating numbskulls.
Okay, for once I'll bite.
While I do like to think of myself as a voice of reason, thanks, Salon is more like a cozy parlor to me than a wilderness, and really, I don't see very much man-hating going on here at all. I'm sorry if you feel that there is — all I can offer is that in my experience real hatred of men as a matter of politics and policy seems to be (thankfully) out of fashion by about 25 years.
I would only correct that many men cannot get sex PERIOD without it being underhanded, or at least less than above board.
Well, you know what they say about the one constant in all your failed romantic encounters...
And anyway, let's be clear here — "underhanded" is not the same as "rape." At all. Everyone can agree on that, right?
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@ Amity
"underhanded" is not the same as "rape." At all. Everyone can agree on that, right?
Underhanded is not rape but it can be a strategy for rape and can lead to rape. Some instance:
1. Putting a drug in someone's drink to render them unable to to resist.
2. Getting a naive or inexperienced drinker drunk specifically for the purpose of completing the sex act whether consensual or not.
3. Luring someone away from a group to a more isolated place where they may be raped when the purpose of the luring is to obtain sex by any means necessary. In other words, the guy may prefer the sex to be consensual but not rule out force.
Prosecuters, judges, and juries already weigh intent. That is part of the process. Sometimes charges are not brought simply because intent is too murky. It is simply not true that all a woman has to do is say she was raped and things proceed to trial. Also, when people talk about "false accusations" they are often including those case which, for various reasons, did not proceed to trial. Even the word unfounded does not mean false. It merely means that the prosecution doubted it could get a conviction. The words "not guilty" do not mean innocent, otherwise we would all be convinced that OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson had never committed crimes.
It is disingenuous to ignore these realities. I am talking about the legal system in the US. I am unfamiliar with any other.
BTW, the US system seems to be working. Incidents of rape are declining. Sometimes, toughness is a deterrent. Also education about consensual sex, nonconsensual sex and rape laws should be presented in high school, along with general sex education. This way young people will understand the consequences of bad behavior. At the same time, there would certainly be nothing wrong with discussing wise behavior, responsible drinking, and how to avoid becoming victim.
However, none of this will deter sociopathic type rapist. Those types are homegrown and not subject to reason.
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@Amity
"what you describe is pretty close to how things used to work, and we decided that we didn't like that. So I think it's worth asking why, and whether we want to return to the age of elaborate social barriers."
It is? I'm thinking specifically in scenarios which involve questionable consent, which, to my mind, mostly involves altered states of consciousness: being drunk, stoned, unconscious, mentally impaired, or otherwise not functioning as a reasoning adult.
The vast majority of encounters probably involve ... vast quantities of alcohol. (As a college professor, I see and hear about the drinking/partying/hookup behaviors of plenty of young adults). So when I say "Don't be stupid" I'm largely thinking in terms of binge drinking scenarios.
I think there's a wide, bright line between "behave like a sailor on shore leave" and "behave like a middle-class Victorian" for both genders.
But the main point I've been making is that many male posters feel manipulated and victimized by women who (hypothetically) lure them into sex, and then cry "rape!" later. And to these people, I suggest they conduct themselves in a manner that will reduce the possibility of being accused of rape, or of actually forcing sex on someone who can't truly consent.
(BTW, does anyone find the logic of "any woman can have sex whenever with any guy" a bit incompatible wih "so guys need to tricj women into having sex"? If the girls are soooo easy, shouldn't it be ... easy?)
Does that mean ultimately less sex? Yeah. But ultimately better (and memorable!) sex.
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but isn't RAPE funny?
But isn't RAPE funny when it happens to men in prisons. Doesn't it still get laughs on late night tv? Isn't it a stable of cop shows? A man will be locked in a cell with his rapist and being that rapist's bitch for the duration of their sentence is just justice at it's most hilarious.
Come on now, stop your laughing for a moment and ask yourself where people get the idea that rape is ok from.
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Logic is not JB's strong point
BTW, does anyone find the logic of "any woman can have sex whenever with any guy" a bit incompatible wih "so guys need to tricj women into having sex"? If the girls are soooo easy, shouldn't it be ... easy?
Nearly any woman has pull to get sex at whim. Most men do not.
So feminism has led to a condition where hot men get LOTS more sex and all other men gets LOTS LESS.
Sounds like a winning long-term atrategy ladies.
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Actually, it is
Evolutionarily speaking.