@Anonymous: I have no idea what you mean by this question.

The Church is the community of the faithful. I have no idea how that creates "auto erotic" of some kind in such a situation.

then pedophile priests who have sex with children in the church must only be engaging in a form of auto erotica and therefore no abuse took place, right Chris W? Is that your argument?

Re janice's letter

there is no difference bertween "the church" and "its flock". We *are* the church. All 1.1 billion of us.

That so called vativcan wealth is a myth.

Officially the vatican lives off contributions from all catholics. Less officially, there is a church quip that the archdioceses of Chicago and Cologne together supply more than half of the Vatican budget.

People make all fuss about the church's history, but they are our cultural heritage, and I doubt anybody intends to throw away all our collective heritage to satifsy a bunch of bile spewing american protestants. These items, be they art or historical writings, or buildings, are not assets in any economic sense.

Economically the Vatican and the Catholic Church are rather poor organizations.

Just read Chris W's post:

"Making laws that unevitably steer churches into bankruptcy has the very definite effect of deprieving catholics of the freedom of religion." [sic]

That is an unfortunate byproduct for good priests and good catholics, but if an institution, be it a church or a corporation, unleashes something harmful on the populace, maybe it deserves to be bankrupted if it refuses to protect the public. If the church made any effort at all to actually protect its flock, instead of just covering its own ass, people might feel less vengeful.

especially given that these are people who've allegedly taken a vow of poverty. (not to mention celibacy, huh?)

When the verdict in LA was read, it occurred to me that perhaps the Vatican has some really expensive art lying around and maybe could put a couple of those bad boys on the market to raise the cash. They should think of it as selling themselves an indulgence to buy off their sins. The Catholic Church is good at that, no?

This is from another opinion which I commented on assisting the community when someone convicted of a sex offense wants to worship.

I understand the betrayal one feels at having an organization, which is supposed to be serving God and humanity, ignore pleas for help and hurt others, that is not tolerable. But in healing from this and letting the Church know this is not tolerated, we need to be careful not to let ourselves turn into something we are not, something darker which will never let go of us or society. I worry when someone, who has a family, a job, who is a good citizen in society, can have cold, angry, revenge-filled hands from 20 years earlier drag the accused and their family into a never ending abyss of terror, hatred and poverty.

I am a social researcher who worries when comments such as "on a skewer" are evoked in regard to someone who may or may not have committed a sex offense. I am also equally concerned when I hear about former victims who are uncomfortable if someone who has committed a sex offense is working or worshiping next to them. The person who committed the sex offense and the victim after the fact, are different sides of the same coin. We have been repeatedly told that the prior will never change and we have a silent agreement that the latter person, the victim, must never forget they are a victim, nor should they heal. The point is, and it is proven out, that with the exception of the truly mentally disturbed person, whom we do not yet know how to treat, people can and do change and mature. The frontal lobe of our brains does not mature until after our 20's and this area is the focus of impulsive behaviors. Yet, we are willing, even after treatment and punishment to mark people for life so they may continue to be punished, forcing them into survival behavior. We also in another manner mark the victim for life so that they may never heal. There is an actress from Little House on the Prairie, that while I feel for the fact she was a victim, I also think back in the recesses of my mind, she wouldn't be appearing on television talk shows and would have faded into obscurity or created another career, if she didn't evangelize her victim hood. In this vicious cycle we force people not to heal and become better people.

We need to ask where this paranoia,persistent accusation, punishment and victim hood will bring us in the future.

Hysteria is a virus, which spreads virulently through society making everyone a victim. It's not that child abuse is not a problem in our society, but we need to speak the inconvenient truth of how we came to be like this, how to address the real problems and how not to go off the deep end when media and politicians serve us a plate of usually hyped terror.

People rebuild their lives, create families and try to be better citizens, we need to let them repent and we need to forgive.

When we mark them for life, keep them from good jobs, schools, harass and threaten their spouses and their children, it is then we as a nation become something darker and more reminiscent from a time where one man espoused: "The Catholic Church considered the Jews pestilent for fifteen hundred years, put them in ghettos, etc, because it recognized the Jews for what they were. … I recognize the representatives of this race as pestilent for the state and for the church and perhaps I am thereby doing Christianity a great service by pushing them out of schools and public functions." 26 April 1933, [Adolph Hitler, cited from Richard Steigmann-Gall's The Holy Reich]

I am a former victim, but no more. Now I sit next to a man in service who was a former sex offender, but is no more, and I am happy for him.