I wonder what has more stigma in our society, and what SHOULD have more stigma

(1) A man who has two children by two different women, and he lives with neither of them.

(2) A man like #1, except he also doesn't pay child support.

(3) A single mother with two children from two different fathers.

(4) A single mother with 6 children from 6 different fathers.

(5) A married couple with 10 children.

(6) A married woman who has 4 children who has had 2 abortions.

(7) A single woman with no children who has had 2 abortions.

It seems that #1, 2, 3, 6, and 7 should be equivalent, but they're not. Especially between 6 and 7 -- the single woman is viewed as more selfish, and I think that our society even views #1 as slightly better than #7.

Maybe a few abortions wouldn't have hurt couple #5, or woman #4.

Something not mentioned in this article is that the number of years that women can potentially get pregnant has grown because of more calories in the American diet - especially calories from fat. Women have more years to have mistakes, and those mistakes often happen in the early or later years of fertility. Also, American women, between the onset of puberty and menopause, have 13 periods each year - more than in the past - and again due to improvements in the diet. That's 13 opportunities to mess up birth control - especially easy to do if your partner refuses to wear a condom; or you live in a rural area where the pharmacist is a religious nut job.

I have a friend who is an ob/gyn in the Shenandoah Valley, and she routinely sees pregnant 13 year old girls. AND these girls often have a mother who is pregnant! These are 40 year old women having babies with their babies! They are ALWAYS from poor families; the parents rarely made it to finishing high school; and babies born to girls that young just isn't a big deal.

I'm thrilled that women are having, if necessary, multiple abortions. They are self-selecting themselves out of the gene pool and out of the parent pool. We should be grateful. (Or do we live in such a PC world that it isn't okay to write this??)

I know of people who've had more than one abortion and thought, "couldn't you have found a more reliable contraceptive after the first time?"

And then I met a woman with three kids already and a Norplant device who still got pregnant. Which was pretty darn unintended for her.

I guess the point is, women have abortions for all sorts of reasons. And I don't think I, the State or the Government should decide if her reason is good enough.

Most people agree that abortions can be acceptable (if unfortunate) under certain circumstances--rape, incest, protecting the health of the mother. The thing is, do we make a woman prove she was raped? Is it not rape if she doesn't file a police report? How do we decide if an abortion is necessary to protect a woman's physical or mental health? The bureaucracy needed to police this properly would be ridiculous.

As much as you may dislike a woman's reason for having an abortion, would you prefer she be a "frivolous" aborter or a would-be frivolous aborter who is instead forced to be a parent?

When in graduate school, I got careless and managed to get my then-girlfriend pregnant. She had an abortion. For me, it was an unspeakably awful experience -- I still live with the guilt, and some very, very unpleasant memories. I was there with her when it was done. I often think about that child, who would now be about thirteen. And this was a relatively easy procedure -- she was only about six weeks along, there were no complications, and the whole process took about half an hour.

If it was that horrendous for me, I cannot even begin to imagine what a nightmare it was for her. Which brings me to my point.

Why would any woman, ever, short of contraception failure, go through something like this TWICE? Or three times? Twice, just maybe. But anything beyond that I think indicates some serious emotional issues.

How do these stats refute the nymphet caricature?

"Most women seeking abortions in 2002 were low-income ... 60 percent had at least one child. In addition, the report found that most women who had more than one abortion were over age 30 and that most women who had an abortion in 2002 were using contraception at the time of conception."

I once knew someone that used publically funded abortions as contraceptive. I don't recall the actual number of abortions she'd had, but it was a bit more than two. She was over 30, low income, and had multiple children (who had been removed from her custody). She was single, and getting pregnant by men in their 20s, because, as she said, she didn't like the feel of condoms. So.... I don't get how being low income, over 30 and having children somehow makes her a responsible person. I'm also not sure how a stat on the contraceptive habits of "most women" applies to those that are having multiple abortions. Isn't that a different subset of the data?

To fuck up a decent debate with bullshit.

It's not a question of only being allowed to debate and then focus on the "one worst thing." I'd say every one of the points LeCastor raised plus women who have multiple abortions are all issues worthy of our time and attention. And while shame and guilt are ineffective as stand-alone policy, I see nothing wrong with education, enlightenment, counseling, and a healthy dose of "respectable people simply do not behave that way" when it comes to helping people develop the self-respect necessary to lead healthy, responsible lives.

LeCastor, I am sorry you have not come to terms with your abortions. To continue to project your self-hatred onto others is getting old. I would urge you to come to terms with your past so that perhaps your future might be spent in healthier pursuits.

I'm one of those pro-choice women who is very uncomfortable with the idea of multiple abortions.

The article states that many pro-life advocates say many women have abortions cavalierly. Unfortunately they’re right in many cases.

I was troubled in college when a friend had 2 abortions. Both times she got pregnant because it wasn't romantic to use a condom in the heat of passion. I can understand that it happened once, though I still think it was irresponsible. I had more trouble being sympathetic when it happened a second time 6 months later.

I think abortions should be rare. They should be a last resort for women whose birth control failed, who don't have access to birth control, or who are victims of rape or incest. They should be a last resort after Plan B (the morning after pill). I know this is idealistic. I know that realistically, abortion needs to remain legal because not every woman has access to birth control and that birth control fails and that we'll never wipe out rape and incest. I don't think we can legislate how many abortions someone has, because that's a slippery slope and every situation is unique.

As for multiple abortions carrying a stigma – I don’t see there’s anything wrong with that. I know there are exceptions, but it seems that many of these multiple abortions are due to irresponsible behavior. I don’t see why we should pat these women (and men) on the head and say, that’s okay, it was an honest mistake. It probably was an honest mistake the first time (again, in most cases). The 2nd time you should know better. Most of us manage to go through life without multiple abortions, so it’s not that tough to do. Take some responsibility for yourself and use birth control already.