As Mark Twain allegedly said, "There are three kinds of falsehoods: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

To which I add a fourth: Conservaboob discussions of health care.

Harry/Louise there pulls out the Rush Limbaugh-style crap about huge waits. That's all lies, damned lies and conservaboob annecdotes.

What is TRUTH is that today 1) hospitals charge non-insured people full price, while giving price cuts to insured patients 2) insurance companies find hundreds of ways to deny coverage 3) my daughter had a cancer when she was 2, and might be uninsurable for her life 4) there are no laws against genetic discrimination 5) 17-20 % of all health care dollars are spent on administration 6) many physicians have to employ a full-time person to juggle forms 7) insurance companies routinely contest the charges that physicians send them.

We have tried the "free market" for health care, and it is a miserable and total failure.

It's time to stop listening to the conservaboobs, and go to

a full 100 % of the population expansion of Medicare. The conservaboobs have had their chance, and just like every other area, they have demonstrated that they are MISERABLE FAILURES.

Yet another conservaboob tries: People in England buy extra insurance.

Well, DUH, Mr. Conservaboob. This is a demonstration of the SUCCESS of the British system. For most people, the system works fine. The public insurance system works. If you need extra insurance, you buy it. So, there is an additional private market.

The point, for the POINT-OBLIVIOUS, is that the system provides a safety net at the bottom. It also provides a better class of care for those who want to spend.

What could be better than that?

Geez, conservaboobs are simply not getting any more clever.

"every other industrial country spends half of what we do on health care."

Mr. Conservaboob, what he/she left off is "and get better health care."

Our infant mortality is ranked about 35, well below England, France, Germany and many other countries with socialist systems.

In most bankruptsy proceedings, a health care problem is usually at the start. This is even true with people with insurance, since many insurance plans require a large co-pay or have coverage limits.

The US health care system is broken beyond repair.

Geez, talk about whack-a-mole

The other problem with your "thinking" abilities, dataguyx, is that you simply assume I think our system is perfect because I defend it against the alternative. Such thinking is the product of a simplistic mind incapable of juggling more than one idea at a time.

I have no idea where that came from.

You have not addressed a single one of my points. If you wish to have a conversation, do me the politeness of staying on message.

What about the insurance system? Universal coverage cuts out 17-20 % spent on insurance, and goes from 60 forms to 1. Many physicians (not doctors, i am a doctor) would be very happy with that.

What about the genetic discrimination?

What about the pre-existing conditions?

What about children who need medical care?

Public systems have flaws. They are far superior to our current failed system.

Obviously, the defensive christofascists are uncomfortable with their outing as fascists, and are trying to pull the old "reductio ad Hitlerum" obfuscation.

Current religious fascists are fascistic, but are not Nazis. Who ever said that fascists must be nazis? Now, of course, many of them ASPIRE to nazi-like powers - witness the christofascist wet dreams in the "Left Behind" series, in which christofascist nazis have wet dreams about the destruction of their enemies. These are the only books which I have ever forbidden my children from reading.

The fascists who run most of the big-box churches are moral fascists, in that they seek to control the thoughts, emotions and most importantly wallets of their sheeple followers. That is the truth, and I sure am glad that many of the fascists who are posting here are uncomfortable.

He's sold out to the christian fascists. He now runs the BS Express, not the Straight Talk Express.

I have never understood the point of independence anyway. Politics is a team sport. I play on the Dem team. I don't see what the point of running around by yourself is, anyway.

Yep, this is gonna set a record. Actually, it will set two records, both equally irrelevant.

1) Who is the first black head coach to win a Superbowl?

2) Who is the first black head coach to lose a Superbowl?

Always, 100 % of the time, have an intimate examination with a nurse present, regardless of the sex of the physician. This is a pretty simple rule, and if everyone followed it, a huge number of problems would NEVER arise.

My 15 year old daughter went to her pediatrician. He did a chest exam by putting his stethascope right up inside her shirt. I was present as a witness. It was a clearly clinical examination, and it was obvious that nothing untoward was occurring. However, if I had not been there, she might have misunderstood, or other things might have happened.

Get a witness.

This is just great.

Now, Libby is guilty of 4 of 5 counts. And this isn't billing his clients falsely or any of that crap during the Clinton administration.

This is lying about treason.

Libby should now be tried for treason. Treason in wartime (conservaturds are always claiming we are at war) is a capital offense.

Shoot the little turd.

appear to have gathered here to roast Garrison.

Well, fruck you all. Keillor's gentle, reasonable comments were his to make, and I support them.

the first time he has written about gay marriage, but

This isn't the first time Keillor has written ugly things about gay marriage. He's spoken out pretty clearly against it.

Clearly the most moronic thing I've read all day. Because, what Garrison wrote was not ugly, except to people who are ugly themselves.

I've thought that for a long time. Brings out the wingnuts.

It cost us the 2004 election. Without that issue on the ballot in Ohio, Kerry would have won.

So, quit bitching, folks. Keillor is right.