I saw a Star Trek: The Next Generation episode just last night in which a 60 year old was scheduled to die...and he was doing research to save his planet from a dying sun.

When he refused to commit ritual suicide because he wanted to save his planet, they ostrasized him and refused his data. They thought that he just HAD to kill himself to perpetuate their society.

If this is what we are really headed toward, I'm glad I'm as old as I am and won't have to deal with it at a later date. And if I do live that long...well, let's just say it will cost them to get me kicking and screaming to the death chamber.

whether someone has the right to DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES whether or not they want to die.

Let's be clear about this...we are talking about whether the individual has this right or if we want to give the STATE the right to decide this.

Do we want to retain the ability to decide for ourselves if we want to go on or do we want the government to decide that for us?

Frankly, I'd much rather decide that for myself, thank you.

Let's see what this COST us first.

BTW, if one of the ladies were my daughter or wife, I would go to the NK airport, thank Mr. Clinton, and ride back WITH them.

Sorry but given his track record, I STILL wouldn't trust him alone with either wife OR daughter.

"Keep moving, troll. The year is 2009, not 1999."

Hey, it's not 2001 or 2004 either...so moveon.org!

"Two American women released, no promises made, and no lost of face."

AH but we don't KNOW if any promises were made yet or not. Recall, Jimmy Carter went to North Korea during the Clinton years...and they got a treaty which Carter announced on CNN without the permission of the Clinton White House as a way to force the US into action. The Clinton Administration signed a later version of the Agreed Framework, under which North Korea agreed to freeze and ultimately dismantle its current nuclear program and comply with its nonproliferation obligations in exchange for oil deliveries, the construction of two light water reactors to replace its graphite reactors, and discussions for eventual diplomatic relations.

ALL of which North Korea reneged on at the outset and hid from the US.

So it will be interesting to see if Clinton tries the same gambit on Obama.

Paranoia??? After the numerous times he's been caught cheating on his wife??? THAT, my friend is NOT paranoia!

As for do I consider myself a conservative or a liberal...I am an independent...but I tend toward conservative. However, I have no stomach for ANY of the politicians in DC right now.

I side with neither as both tend to the ridiculous to me.

Take that as you will.

"Bush the elder also had a mistress."

Really? Are you talking about Jennifer Fitzgerald? Was that ever verified? I don't think I ever saw that.

"Carter was sent to North Korea during the Clinton administration expressly to find a way to avoid a war."

Ah yes, but YOU yourself said he had no POWER to actually make a treaty...yet he did it and Clinton went along with it...which I expect was probably the only thing he could do at that point. Carter was just an envoy at the time.

"Clinton, unlike Carter, had one goal - ask for the two American women to be pardoned - and Bill got what he asked for, no strings attached."

Again, I will wait to see if any stings are attached or not. I wait for the final outcome before making statements.

"Yes you are weird and paranoid."

Hardly. If someone is a KNOWN womanizer, would you want YOUR daughter on a trans-Atlantic (or trans-Pacific) flight with him?

"By your logical we can't trust Bush the elder either, because he also had a mistress."

With my daughter in a plane? Hell no!

"Neither can we trust Governor Sanford, Senator Vitter, Senator Ensign, and form mayor Rudy "9/11""

Again, to all of the above with my daughter in a room all alone with them, HELL NO. BUT, that does NOT mean I couldn't trust them with running the government...just that I couldn't and WOULDN'T trust them to be around my wife or daughter.

You never answered my question.

WAS the mistress of George H. Bush VERIFIED? I tried to look it up on Snopes but nothing came up.

"Wait all you want, but I hope you are not holding your breath."

We'll see.

I did a google search on Jennifer Fitzgerald already...but I saw no verification of the relationship.

I was asking if you knew if it was a verified relationship or not. We KNOW Clinton had an affair with Jennifer Flowers and Monica.

if 83% of the population is covered by healthcare they LIKE, then only one of two things are going to happen:

1. The Democrats push thru their agenda and get healthcare passed - but LOSE the House and Senate - and possibly the next Presidency - in the bargain

OR

2. The Democrats in Congress realize that if they pass this, they will lose their jobs and it fails to pass.

Only ONE of two possibilities will occur, IMO.

"Scale up those numbers And we're talking a billion dollars or so, total cost. Hell, be generous. Ten billion. That's still hundreds of times cheaper than Iraqistan."

Sorry Pragma, but if you want to scale the numbers up for healthcare for the US, you'd better scale up those numbers into the trillions of dollars.

You know, we can drop OUT of Afghanistan at any time...Iraq too.

Now tell me how we could drop out of healthcare anytime?

Besides, 87% of the country is covered by healthcare...and 83% are HAPPY with their healthcare. So why screw with a working system?