Which would caused Pullman the most trouble?

1--Writing novels attacking religion in general and Roman Catholocism in particular?

2--Or naming a stuffed animal toy John Paul?

Well, at least the Catholic League isn't demanding Pulman's death!

I havn't seen the movie but I assume that there is no teddy bear named Mohammad in the movie so I assume Pulman is safe!

My understanding is, they cleaned up the movie. The three book series apparently has God as an enemy of some kind, and in the end, the heroes kill Him.

The concern among Catholics and evangelical Christians is, the movie will excite interest in the book. The series' author has not hidden the intent to write an anti-Christian fiction set, so it's not as though we are assuming things.

As has been pointed out, though, we aren't issuing a fatwa or anything. We just aren't going to go see it.

"The Golden Compass" celebrates independent thinking, [thereby] exposing children to "the Demonic".

. . . and asses bray. Nothing new here.

Sorry, but I read stuff like "maybe the story is about something else" and it just shits me to tears. Sure, cherry-pick what you want from the teachings of your religion and just ignore the rest.

...or grow up, accept that you KNOW the whole God thing makes no sense whatsoever and the value system you're using to do that cherry-picking actually is YOUR value system - it doesn't need some bloody imaginary deity to justify it.

Movie looks interesting, though ;)

The whole premise of religion is that we have a choice, to choose right or wrong. God does not make the choice for us.

I personally think that is part of the problem. If I was running the universe, I would make all the choices. You hear me kids? I am running this little universe while you live under this roof.

For those who naively think that Catholicism is a milder form of extremism than, say, Islam, I beg to differ.

Some things I have personally experienced:

1) Choked by my father when I refused to go to church.

2) Shunning

3) Threats of excommunication

4) Threats of disownment

We're talking about a kid here.

Of course, I got off lucky. Other kids got it up the butt from their priest.

Watch as the anti-religious loonies parade around as though anyone cared what they 'thought.'*

* I use the term 'thought' loosely because the people who most delight in calling faith/religion/spirituality/etc stupid are often some of the more stupid people you'll encounter. A delightful irony that is almost as annoying as equally stupid religious loonies.

Why don't all you loonies just have a little party and leave thoughtful, dialogue-engaged people alone? It's too bad my God and my religion prevent me from telling you to just fuck off entirely, because I'd sorely like to.

Well, I loved the books. But there is a lot of tension between "atheism" and a God actually existing to be killed off at the end of it all. (I think of this series as "Nietzsche for children.")

I enjoy the tension in this and how much is unknown and unknowable. I will be taking my kids to see this, and we have Pullman's fantastic audiobook rendering of the whole series for long car trips. We read the bible at bedtime too. The Garden of Eden is endlessly fascinating. We can't help noticing that the snake tells the truth about the fruit; it's God who lies to Adam. Why does God fear us knowing too much and being too much like Him? Hmm, I guess He saw Nietzsche (and Pullman) coming...

The three book series apparently has God as an enemy of some kind, and in the end, the heroes kill Him.

I presume, then, you're not going to bother to actually read the books to see how wrong you are and how much more nuanced Pullman's narrative is.

For those who may, this is a spoiler alert. For those who simply won't, let me clear up this misconception.

The character of Lord Asriel is the only one in these books out to destroy God, and calling him a "hero" is not just an overstatement, but a blatant falsehood. There are plenty of heroes in this series, but Asriel certainly isn't one of them.

The God figure (known in the book as "The Authority") is not portrayed as "evil," although his origin story is that of an opportunist--he was the first angel to realize what he was, and therefore declared himself God.

The "enemy" in this book is the Magisterium, which is so afraid of prophecies, possibilities, and anything else that threatens their socio-political influence (but not, it should be noted, anything that threatens the scripture) that they have taken to kidnapping children and cutting out their souls. They hound the young heroine of these books practically unto death out of concern that she is the reincarnation of Eve.

In the end, the heroes don't "kill God." In the end, God has already dramatically weakened himself by handing his power over to the Metatron, for the specific purpose of killing all those who dare oppose him. "God" dies in the form of a shriveled old being, running scared from the field of a battle wherein people are dying left and right out of either love of Him or hatred of Him...not that he cared one way or the other.

It's a subversive book because it dares suggest that powerful organizations have much to lose when the people they control decide to think for themselves. That's unfortunate.

So, when will you loonies be having your party?

Thank you! My god this is refreshing to read! "The Golden Compass" (the book) is a fascinating look into the very thing which seems to drive your ability to think critically and still maintain ties, by conscious choice, to a religious rite which gives you some comfort. This is a Big Deal.

It has troubled me since pre-adolescence that many of the most religious people I've known (as well as many I've only heard or read) feel their belief systems are so incredibly fragile that any word/image/idea which doesn't back up their position may well destroy it, is capable of actually sweeping away the innocent dupe of the Only True Religion. If there is anything to an article of faith it is the faith in the article. If the thing is that flimsy then it needs to be brushed aside in favor of some new horizon. If someone can kill Zeuss than Zeuss must be killed. Bless you for allowing your daughter to experience this openness in all its wonderfulness, even though the movie may deviate somewhat from the book. That's just a degree of nuance.

You have planted a seed and it will grow.