In 1972, the Supreme Court ruled that the Fourth Amendemnt prohibits warrantless eavesdropping as part of domestic terrorism investigations. The Court expressly said that it was not opining on whether the same result would be compelled for international terrorism investigations/intelligence gathering -- and, of course, Bush apologists claim that the Fourth Amendment does not apply -- even though the reasoning is exactly the same.

From your response I get the feeling that the issue of warrants for international terrorist investigations (as in one person in America and others outside of it) has not been clearly decided by the Supreme Court. Or is it that because one person is in America, that makes it domestic surveillance?The '72 decision dealt with domestic eavesdropping, not international. If I understood your response correctly. However my question was about blanket warrants. Warrants based not on an individual basis, but issued for a large generic group of people. Say members of CAIR or some group like that. Don't warrants have to be issued on an individual basis? That was what my question was about.

Well I think we can conclude that we no longer live in a democracy anymore. Our "representatives" in congress don't listen to us voters anymore. They listen to their corporate campaign contributers. They listen to their corporate lobbyists. What we have is a gov't that has merged itself with the interests of businesses. Its a corpotracy. Mussolini said that fascism should really be called corporatism. If you read Naomi Klein's "Shock Doctrine", she details how the Bush admin has hollowed out our gov't. Everything that used to be done by the gov't, is now done by private contractors. Look at the use of Blackwater for instance. In Iraq they protect State dept personel. Why? The State dept has it's own diplomatic security service. There is no need for blackwater to protect our diplomats, when the DSS should be doing it. But then a private contractor wouldn't be making huge profits off our tax dollars, if that happened.

Just finished reading the post over at firedoglake and it seems that immunity for the telco's will be part of the bill. We have no idea who they have been listening to but they are going to get immunity for it. As for the poster who said maybe we should be inspiring the dems instead of condemning them. Well if the damn congressional dems can't state their case to the american people, on why immunity for prior lawlessness is a bad idea. I don't think it matters one damn bit if I try to do it for them. I'm not in congress and I don't get to vote. While a few dems in congress were against immunity, the leadership was always going to do it. Pelosi and Reid have caved to Bush on everything he's demanded, why change the pattern now? Can't risk losing the next election, now can we? The repugs might call us names and say we are weak on terror. That would just be terrible, better cave in and give Bush everything he wants. Bye bye 4th amendment, it was nice while it lasted. Hello police state.

The dem pattern in this BS ritual make me sick. Senators like Leahy ask questions of the proposed nominee. Maybe act like they are disturbed by the responses, but then go ahead and vote to confirm the guy. They did this with Gonzo, Roberts, and Alito. So this fascist-enabling judge will become the next AG. Watch for the media to report crap like this guy is known for his independence. He won't be like Gonzo, he'll stand up to Bush. Yeah and pigs are going to fly out of my ass. Once again Bush gets what Bush wants, and we have no one but the dems to blame for it.

We no longer live in a democracy anymore. It's clear we live in a fascist/corpatist state. Gov't is run by and for the corporations of America. Our "representatives" represent the companies and their business plans. We the little people don't even appear on their radar. A company gets caught breaking the law, well just buy immunity from congress. That the dems are in on the whole-sale destruction of our constitution and system of gov't, should of been apparent when Bush commuted Libby's sentence. What was such an obvious obstruction of justice, and a clear quid pro quo. Libby you lie to the grand jury, and we'll make sure you don't serve anytime. Yet the dems stood back and did nothing. That they didn't immediately move to impeach Bush, should of been the sign the fix was in. Now the gov't has carte blanche to spy on who ever they want, remember this bill is going to be permanent. I'm not the only one seeing the hand-writing on the wall here, this is only the beginning. Who do you think they'll use these spying powers on next? When the prez says he can lock anyone up on his say so, what's to stop him from locking up anyone that disagrees with him. He already has people arrested that have protest signs along his motorcade route. While pro-Bush sign holders are left alone. In 1930's Germany, when Hitler was coming to power, some saw the writing on the wall. They saw that things were only going to worse and got out. So in all sincerity I am asking, is it time to leave yet?

Even though I'm out of work, I gave to Dodd for what he did. It wasn't much but all I could afford. Please donate to him and ask your friends to do the same.