For the record, I appreciate your passionate but thoughtful posts and wish more were like it. In fact, that's all I want. I couldn't stand it if salon were a sycophantic site where everyone agreed. As to your points, I'll try to address but I should warn you that i've since moved to my son's laptop and am not technologically comfortable right now! (not sure I can get back and forth to your post easily, so I'll try to do it from memory)

1. I honestly never heard that point before about Obama saying his voters wouldn't cross over. I usually like to have direct source in front of me, but I can't manage a search on this computer right now and am happy to take your word for it. Without having seen or heard it in context, I would have to agree with Kingbreaker's analysis of it. There's a difference between suggesting that one's supporters to begin with are "crossover voters"--indies and repubs--who will vote for you and not your opponent (It's pretty established, isn't it, that he attracts indies? I mean, wasn't that kind of a factual statement?) than to have two sets of entrenched dems, all of whom "should" vote for whichever dem wins but a large portion of one which does not. Ugh--sorry for the inarticulation--this set up is not working for me. but enough with my whining. Do you get what I mean here?

2. Of course Obama fans have been mean and sniping. I acknowledged that. I actually and honestly think it's been worse coming from your side, but that's just another version of "my dad's better than yours" or something, so I think we can both just assume that there's been nastiness on both sides, that we each think the other side's been worse, and move on. On the sexism/racism thing, though, I have to say that I honestly don't think there's been racism coming from Hillary supporters, while I know H supporters have claimed sexism all over the place, often where I honestly don't see it. At this point, I don't know whose side that statement supports; I just see it as true. :)

Anyway, there have been a few good eggs hanging around salon, earnestly fighting the good fight, laying out evidence, asking respectful questions, starting with the assumption that those they talk to aren't dismissive of their own views. I speak of you, juliebird, KStone, little lord baltimore, uncle fester, kingbreaker, doloresflower, chhabili, ben sen, and many others whose names I can't think of. I think if you look at my history of letters you will see that I am nothing if not earnest. I have found it distressing at times to find even reasonable folk generalizing and stereotyping about Obama supporters, being sarcastic, making assumptions, etc. But of course that's going on both ways. I ask that we just assume non-troll true salonistas are smart enough not to fawn over an ephemeral candidate without substantive reason or to dismiss the other out of sexism. Before this year, I wouldn't have dreamed that any of us would be guilty of any of that. As a final point on this particular subject, I have also wondered why so many people are so unwilling to offer any concessions when they speak. I do it all the time, not as a ploy but because in fact life is like that: some stuff is good about your candidate, some stuff not so good. Many of us are terribly thoughtful and certainly recognize that our own candidate is imperfect, but very few admit any of this in discussion. It bothers me.

3. I think you hit the nail on the head when you mention toward the end of your post that many Hillary supporters are bitter that Obama jumped into the game a bit early when she was so poised to make a successful run. I think it's unfortunate that you threw the word "female" in there; surely you will be reamed for sexism right there. I don't think there is any doubt that were this about Obama being black, that charge would be thrown around. As to the substance, I don't know what to say except that Obama has won me over. My early posts show me undecided; I have evolved to where I am. I don't think anyone is entitled to the position; I think they have to earn it.

that's all I can think of --hope this doesn't come out too long.

about the "I'm quitting you, salon!!" letters. Don't we all have at least one of those in our file? I know I do. How embarrassing. I think I stayed away for a day.

You have to understand that he was a savior after the ineffectual Taft, who was whipped into submission by the rabid Republican state congress (who, no lie, debated for days in 2003 about whether to ratify the Fourteenth Amendment. You heard that correctly. Turns out that back in 1868 Ohio rescinded its ratification of the Amendment that allows blacks to vote, so the Ohio legislature decided to symbolically ratify it in 2003, as a goodwill gesture. Nobody counted on the idiotic Cincinnati lawmakers who actually opposed it on the grounds that it was used to kill 45 million babies. They ended up debating for days whether or not to pass the Fourteenth Amendment. But I digress.) The point is that Strickland seems like a good guy (in spite of his endorsement of someone other than my candidate), but I worry about him.

Check him out on FOX a couple weeks ago. He's on the left. Doesn't it look like he has Parkinson's or something? His spokesperson said to questions the next day that his shakiness was the result of too little sleep and too much caffeine. It looks like more than that to me. What do y'all think?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ugZFX52c0qQ

I think it eliminates any chance whatsoever of VP (and may even be the reason for his vehement dismissal of the idea himself)