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Bill Owen

Published Letters: 1920
Editor's Choice: 6

Thursday, March 20, 2008 01:48 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ Tomhere

"Screw you!" you said. Sounds pretty bellicose to me. Are you trying to start another war?

I assume that you are responding to this comment:

Please read my last line, I was talking about you.

The Only Reason People are Unhappy about Iraq

The only reason Americans, Liberal or otherwise, are "unhappy" (as opposed to the Iraqi's who are "dead") is that America lost that war.

I remember a time, not so long ago, when everyone in America was for the war.

What did they think? That Saddam would be scared off that damn hill? That no children would die?

I know this is too broad a brush. That there were many in America who were "against" the war. But you take my point.

Thursday, March 20, 2008 02:25 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@Kryptic I am not trying to belittle the Opposition

My point was that the opposition, such as it was, not as it was reported in the corporate media, was insufficient. And in retrospect it was.

A lot of the "facts" were reported, not just given much prominence. I guess the question now becomes, how do we get the message out?

And the larger question, in the face of the leaderships almost complete lack of respect for the will of the people, (impeachment is off the table - Pelosi) how do the people take that power back?

Is America a representative democracy or not? If it is not, then the will of the people is irrelevant.

Chtheny seems to think so...

"When asked to comment on a recent poll showing that most Americans say the Iraq war is not worth it, Cheney responded with "so?"

"You don't care what the American people think?" the TV host asked.

"No," Cheney answered. "I think you cannot be blown off course by the fluctuations in the public opinion polls."

Thursday, March 20, 2008 02:28 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ bucky Please reread what I said...

I said that "many" were against the war. Many. That's a lot. Certainly not everyone.

Thursday, March 20, 2008 03:02 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ fleshheart I will have to be more careful

I said that "many" were against the war. Many. That's a lot. Certainly not everyone.

I was trying to make the point that so many were for it that those who were against it did not matter and were not heard. I also was trying to be forceful. I had thought that my last line would clarify my earlier statements.

Sorry for the confusion...

Thursday, March 20, 2008 04:38 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ RMP Is Bush on Ibogaine?

In Fear and Loathing: On The Campaign Trail '72, [Hunter S.] Thompson wrote about a candidate he wanted to take down: "word leaked out that some of [Ed] Muskie's top advisors had called in a Brazilian doctor who was said to be treating the candidate with "some kind of strange drug" that nobody in the press corps had ever heard of."

Thompson later explained, "I started the rumor, but there was a rumor," thus insisting on the veracity of his reporting. Describing an awkward stump speech in Miami, he wrote: "It is entirely conceivable -- given the known effects of Ibogaine -- that Muskie's brain was almost paralyzed by hallucinations at the time; that he looked out at that crowd and saw gila monsters instead of people, and that his mind snapped completely when he felt something large and apparently vicious clawing at his legs."

http://blogs.psychologytoday.com/blog/brainstorm/200802/hunter-the-bullfighter

The effects of ibogaine have been described as dreaming while awake. It's as good an explanation for bush as any. Either that or we could go with that demon from hell meme.

Don't blame me, I am just reporting the "rumor" LOL.

Thursday, March 20, 2008 04:47 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ RMP - Fake smile detector

It's definitely a pathologically self-satisfied smirk, not to be confused with the happy face of a healthy human being. The BBC has a test on its site to see if you can spot a real smile.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/mind/surveys/smiles/index.shtml

Personally, I think an impeachment hearing might help wipe that smirk away. Better yet, a war crimes trial in the Hague might eliminate it permanently.

Then he might learn a lesson. Or as he would say, "are our President learning?".

Thursday, March 20, 2008 07:16 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

Here's a Lesson America has not Learned

What percent of Americans support John McCain? 30, 40, 50, I don't know. I do know that there is a reasonable chance that he will be President.

Can someone tell me how the McCain presidency would be different from the Bush regime? Other than the "straight talk" of course.

Isn't there some lesson to be learned from electing bush?

Thursday, March 20, 2008 07:27 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

Here's a Lesson America has not Learned

What percent of Americans support John McCain? 30, 40, 50, I don't know. I do know that there is a reasonable chance that he will be President.

Can someone tell me how the McCain presidency would be different from the Bush regime? Other than the "straight talk" of course.

Isn't there some lesson to be learned from electing bush?

Thursday, March 20, 2008 07:40 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ Rocket Have you ever met an Iraqi?

I have, I know several. To a man they tell me that things were much better under Saddam. In pre-war Iraq you could go to to school, (they used to have the highest percentage of PHD's in the world) raise your family in safety, the power was on, and the water was clean.

Sure if you were "against Saddam" he was going to put you in meat grinder. Literally.

The problem is in order to "get rid of Saddam" your noble goal, America had to kill anywhere from 30,000 to 1.2 million people and partially vaporise the country to do it.

Iraq is now a hell. Was it worth it?

The Iraqis don't think so. I think it's their call. Not yours.

I do hear that chicken production is now, almost, almost!, back to pre-war levels.

Thursday, March 20, 2008 07:44 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ Blank Monkeys, Millions of them

Even monkeys don't use typewriters anymore. Maybe that's your problem, you need to switch to a computer...

Thursday, March 20, 2008 09:08 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

Education and Critical Thinking

It's interesting that this discussion has devolved into a discussion of education.

Much of the carnage and the horror that the world has experienced flows from a single statement. "They hate us because of our freedoms". - buhs

I will never forget the day I heard that. I almost choked.

It was nonsense then, and it is nonsense now. Why didn't people notice?

Thursday, March 20, 2008 09:23 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

@ Jkalos You Should be!

She should run for President. I hope she does.

Thursday, March 20, 2008 09:26 PM
Original article: Lessons not learned

An important question

Rarely is the question asked, is our children learning? - buhs

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