Christopher1988 wrote:

"It doesn't help when reasonable people still insist Gore really won the presidential race, when he clearly didn't (yes, even after all the votes were re-counted). It is unfortunate, but true, that W. won by a narrow margin and would have under any scenario."

Once again the tiresome lie is repeated. It's a pity that the facts disprove it, eh?

Fortunately I saved the links in case I should run across any GOP liars online.

First, the Virtual Voting Booth. It contains the impartial results of a statewide recount of Florida's 2000 Presidential election votes. You can pick what standards you like (for example, would you accept "hanging chads"? Overvotes? The decision of two out of three ballot judges, or only those in which all three agree?) and see who would have won.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/elections2000/recount/yourvote.html

Here's the second half of the puzzle: Title IX, Ch. 101.5614 of Florida state law as it stood in 2000. It REQUIRED that all votes in which the voter's intent was clear be counted. That includes overvotes.

The (Republican) State Senate in Florida not only revised that law later (I wonder why?) but they even eliminated the online archive of the 2000 version. Fortunately I saved the relevant text. I've highlighted the key portion for your convenience:

"If any paper ballot is damaged or defective so that it cannot be counted properly by the automatic tabulating equipment, the ballot shall be counted manually at the counting center by the canvassing board. The totals for all such ballots or ballot cards counted manually shall be added to the totals for the several precincts or election districts. No vote shall be declared invalid or void if there is a clear indication of the intent of the voter as determined by the canvassing board. After duplicating a ballot, the defective ballot shall be placed in an envelope provided for that purpose, and the duplicate ballot shall be tallied with the other ballots for that precinct."

As you'll see (if you have the guts), if overvotes were counted (as - it's worth repeating - the law at the time REQUIRED) Gore won in virtually every scenario. In fact, George W. would have to push for partially-detached chads to be counted in order to have a chance!

Not to mention the thousands of African-Americans who were illegally denied the right to vote based on a false set of reports from a Texas-based company that already had strong ties to George W. Bush.

American democracy was mugged that day, and it's still in the intensive care unit. I hope it pulls through, despite the sleazy lies of online GOP apparatchiks.

"This isn't the place to get into a prolonged argument, but read Farhad Manjoo. Bush won."

In other words, who am I going to trust - the original sources and my own eyes, or some BS from a pundit that you recommend?

Sorry, I'm not that gullible. I READ the Florida law and checked the virtual voting booth carefully, and the conclusions are incontrovertible.

Isn't it funny? I posted my sources, and you didn't bother to address them - just referred me to Farhad (who is hardly infallible) without so much as a link to back up your utterly undocumented claim.

...the victory of Rahm Emmanuel and the DLC. No punishment is too great for Howard Dean, who committed the unforgivable sin of being right about the 50-state strategy. Not to mention that he didn't play by the usual (i.e. "The Democrats always fight lamely and lose") rules.

Dean will forever be persona non grata to the Washington political and media elite.

It's a new era. All hail the onset of the glorious Obama regime. FISA? Torture? Holding the Bush Administration accountable for war crimes? Obama's broken promises? How gauche of me to mention them!

I slept through 9/11 (I was in surgery that day), and when I woke up the country seemed to have gone insane - particularly the media. I feel the same way now. There's madness in the air, and I for one am very troubled by it.

So troubled, in fact, that on my own journal I've instituted a filter to screen my political posts from everyone except a limited list of friends. It has been made abundantly clear to me that dissent just became far less "acceptable" under the new regime, and that many of my friends and acquaintances who happily accepted my criticisms of the Bush Administration find any critique of Obama to be absolute and unforgivable heresy.

It disturbs me to see so many of my progressive Democratic friends acting in the exact same way as Bush supporters did for so many years - demanding unquestioning obedience to the party line. It disturbs me that in America under a supposedly more liberal and progressive leader, I feel forced to hide my political thoughts. But that's the reality of America today.

I think you've gone insane again, America. Maybe you always were insane. Or maybe it's just the media, indulging in their usual over-the-top orgy of propaganda; I don't know.

But I don't like it. I don't trust you, America. And in another four to eight years, I'm terribly afraid that things will be even worse.