Please tell me from what "neutral" source you get your 25% statistics. Thanks.

From my side, it will not matter what references I give, since you will declare them tainted by the feminist agenda (rape awareness sites, studies carried out by "too liberal" university depts, etc.). So why bother? It's easy to google it.

The point is, false rape accusations are very rare, and disproportionally hyped by the media because they ARE so rare. Women falsely accusing men of raping them is not only NOT a problem, but on the contrary, we should be spending a great deal of our energy on spreading awareness and making it easier for rape victims to come forward.

Men who are predators of women are still quite literally getting away with murder every day in this country (look at Garrido), but we're supposed to be worried about demonizing a woman who is considered to be mentally ill by the authorities involved in the case? Why? This case is ambiguous and not representative, but it clearly gets a lot of men very, very excited and screaming for said woman to be truly raped, jailed for life or even executed publicly.

One wonders why that is. You'd almost think they'd like to make an example of her to make damn sure women are afraid to report rape. Hmmmmm.

well, yes, you pretty much said it, so I'm going to leave it at that.

Agile Cyborg's pet theory doesn't have anything to do with my views on morality. It's just.... rather unlikely.

Myself, personally, I think the woman was drunk/doped out of her mind and was subsequently advised that the case was not going to be prosecutable esp. given the cell phone evidence and the drinking or drug use. She is an immigrant and apparently from a conservative background and her family may have felt shamed, as well. Remember that usuallly the reaction of conservative families to the rape of one of their women is to hush it up.

"We don't really know" may not be a conclusion that pleases the more strident "string 'er up" guys on this thread, but it's the truth.

I am pretty sure that she did not walk into that party intending to end up flat on a bathroom floor with five guys going at her. There are so many reasons why disturbed girls wind up in these borderline rape/men taking advantage scenarios, and most involve young women with a history of abuse who have become overly passive and compliant (that's why so many of these cases involve fundie Christian girls). Alcohol adds to the mix. It doesn't end up being rape exactly, but it isn't a case of the girl having sex that she wanted, not by a long shot.

It's sad, and it is loutish behavior on the part of the men. It's really not excusable that some people think it's okay. It's undoubtedly traumatic for the girl.

Gang bangs belong exactly where Agile Cyborg wants them--in the bedrooms (or bathrooms) of consenting adults who are acting out their fantasies in a manner of their own choosing. Hey, it's nobody's business if they want to add a little nose candy to the party, as far I'm concerned.

But I don't think this is a case of that.

To take another view, if it truly is a case of simple morning after regret, maybe, just maybe, we could say a few unflattering things about five guys who would line up to hump a deluded crazy woman they never saw before. You run a risk when you do that; maybe we should leave guys that dumb to face the consequences. That might include getting your picture all over national T.V. Instead of sending a message to "evil bitches who falsely accuse men", we should send a message to guys--that they should know something about the women they sleep with. Just a minimum, like, whether they're sane, reasonably sober, etc. And if they're incapacitated--instead of viewing it as a golden opportunity and whipping out the cell phone--stay away! Isn't that simple? Then nobody, male or female, gets hurt.

The men have to own some of the responsibility for this--they were at least stupid and maybe criminal. I can't bring myself to care much about their "humiliation". As for the rest of you, your frothing-at-the-mouth artificial outrage really does smack of misogyny to me.

I'll say the same thing I said about the Duke case--the outrage seems a little strange given that the system worked. There was no miscarriage of justice. The problems with the accusation were discovered and the charges dropped, and nobody served any prison time.

So why, exactly, are men flipping out?

Because of the "shame"? Oh, COME ON.

Shame plays no role in a society that believes consensual drunken gang bangs are okay and a topic fit for public discussion. The outrage is artificial, ginned up, and stinks to high heaven of garden variety woman-hating.

The argument goes: "LOOK! Women are bitches who make up rape stories. THIS IS PROOF it ALWAYS happens! These lusty whores should never, ever be believed!!!!"

The entire purpose of the excessive outrage is to undermine the credibility of all women reporting a rape, and to convince others to assume that women reporting rape are liars unless, maybe, they have horrific injuries. And what would anyone want to do that for? Misogyny. Plain and simple.

It's still here, like racism. It hasn't gone anywhere, and I like to call it out when I see it.

to 25 years in the pen on the basis of her story, The Jim and others would have some reason to be getting their rage on.

But they weren't.

So get over your anger, unless the problem is that you're really pissed about something else......

hmmmm?