When the Irak war started - our family nearly broke up - with the "American fraction" accusing the Germans to be

"ungrateful" for all "the help" after the second World War.

It didn't help very much, that everybody knew, it was the Americans who after that war set the Germans straight and taught them invading other countries was a no no. My German and Jewish relatives always got that point but most of the Americans, who mainly live in "the homeland" didn't budge. First there were all these "emotions" which prevented us to insert reason into the discussion. And most of us - even the most "liberal" ones - never questioned "the war" as a immoral, useless, and outdated concept. My daughter, who spends more time in Europe than in the US thinks that all her "F.B.As (full blooded American) relatives are "universal warriors" (with one exception - her father). And as much as she considers "quotations" being "pretentious" she loves to tell her friends "If you don't learn it you have to repeat it,

baby!

the learning ability of humans (not only Americans - Germans can be worst) is highly overrated!

a good example of an American who is unable to learn from history because it will be meaningless to control the oil -

if the major "stockholder" of America are the oil producing nations?

no disagreement here about the plan of "the Empire" just the thought there might be some changes comparable to the plans they had for Irak.

Joan might be Brunhilde - so watch out!

Moving beyond Joan and race

She's not the kind of writer to generalize about the generalizations of a "typical white woman" so here's hoping she gets back to her message soon!

and you might decide to weep for Kriemhilde she was the nicer

girl (not so much bondage and fighting with the guys)

to join this conversation but it is so damn confusing.

We try to learn from history and don't believe it is possible to throw WW1 or WW2 or the Irak war in the same pot. We don't know what to make of America as the "World Police". Some members of our family wouldn't have survived, if America wouldn't have fought the Nazis but we never thought that this

"part of history" could be used as reverence to start the

Irak war. We were in Italy at "shock and awe" and the Italian people took to the streets, while their government supported Bush. We supported America but not Bush and had to take the consequences in America for our stand at a time when it was not very popular. We think it's only fair if Mrs. Slaughter now takes the consequences too.

We think you should not called being "progressive" or "liberal" if you promote reactionary ideas -

You should not think, talking about war is talking about peace - you should not compare "Obamahope" to "Bushhope" -

and we prefer Mahler to Wagner but don't like it when music

is used as a propaganda tool.

We understand that the true reason for the Irak war might be, that America wants to secure the oil resources for America but that would imply that Bush is some kind of strategic thinker. But we sudpect he is a very confused man and he does what a lot of Americans do: He only thinks about the immediate - and not the ultimate consequences. He might be even more confused as we are -and as Joan - and as a lot of the writers over there at "war room". And that's why we really would like to join the party here - If there is room for some more simple and not quite so "poetic" thoughts?

On the other hand, I am sick to death of white people as a group. The truth. that is part of the conversation Obama is asking for, isn't it? I live in Orange County. Every day I see young white females wearing blouses over fake breasts. I'm an old guy. I want to smack them. All of them. They are egregious stereotypes. It's impossible not to think unthinkable Words when they roll up beside you at a stoplight in their brand new Porsches and recordings that are so smooth it makes you ill. . . .

Here's the dirty secret all of us know and no one will admit to. There ARE racists. Black people know it. White people know it. And only white people are allowed to notice and pronounce the truth of it. Which would be fine. Except that white people are not a community but a political party. They can squabble

with each other in caucus but they absolutely refuse to speak the truth in public. And this is the single biggest obstacle to healing the racial divide in this country.

As it works beautiful both ways.

the editor should learn Obamas speech by heart before she keeps on with white grandmothers!

I think you were a little tough on kate - I disagree with everything she states about Obama but I couldn't find that much fault with her experience in New Orleans. I had a similiar experience which let me to a different conclusion.

I am able to vote for Obama or for Hillary but I understand where Obama is coming from.

and comedian once suggested that we should "embrace" our "genetic differences" and he called it "positive racism".

We only were allowed to stress the "positive sides" of our race - We all agreed but than there was this "problem" with playing basketball together and my jewish cousin took great offense when he wasn't picked for the "black and white" team

and he made us forget about "positive racism".

to be a good meatloving vegetarian.

thank you and keep it up!

why couldn't Hillary and Obama from the beginning get into a competition who better takes down McCain?

you are funny!

you might try to improve your vocabulary by reading more poetry!