The Repugs STILL think the reason their party is in such dire straits is that they haven't been big enough assholes. Fred Thompson is proof of that. If he shows his hate enough, he thinks he'll have a chance. My estimate is, he gets 28% of every bipartisan vote he's involved in.

java mama, if you're trying to be satirical, it didn't even remotely come across in your comment. If you're serious, this is, I'm afraid, the wrong forum for such lamebrained nonsense.

And david sugarman, you ever hear of paragraphs? I don't even know if I agree or disagree with what you say, because my poor old eyes just skip right on by that big ol' block of print without reading.

Break things up a little, OK?

Where you been, Sunny Jim? It doesn't make any difference what "weapons" MoveOn gives the Repugnicans It never has mattered.

If MoveOn had taken out a full-page ad to say how deeply they respected and trusted Gen. Petraeus, the Repug pundits would have spent just as much energy and just as much bandwidth/ink/newsprint saying what perfidious wusses they were for changing their minds and supporting him, or some equally snotty attitude.

It doesn't MATTER - whatever happens, the negative part is the fault of the Dems and the good stuff is Bush or someone Bush likes.

I mean, hell, it ain't like this is something NEW or anything. So MoveOn might as well have some fun, is my take on it.

YellowDog - in short, right on.

...the side of those disappointed with the MoveOn ad...

So far on this thread, that would be you, Hrothgar, and Thorin01.

Let me be clear: I haven't seen the ad in question, so I don't know if I agree with it in its entirety or not.

The point I'm making, and if I may speak so freely, the majority of the other commenters here are making, is that it makes NO difference whatever to the Republican assholes who raised the stink, WHAT they raise the stink about, as long as they can use said stink to keep us from looking at what really matters in the discussion! To get sidetracked about how one "disagrees with MoveOn" about something or other is to miss the point that most of us have been trying to make: it's not about what the ad said, it's about the distraction the rightwing noise machine makes from the real issue at hand: Petraeus's willingness to say whatever he thinks will make his political master happy, no matter how many soldiers have to die to "vindicate" him.

I am sick to fuckin' death!! of these people who claim to support the troops, but who don't mind killing a bunch of them to PROVE how much they support them!

I am sick of seeing the headlines about how many young Americans DIED TODAY so old fucks like Bush, Cheney, Petraeus, et al. can still feel something like a hard-on again.

MoveOn has nothing to do with it. They were just the most recent targets. So get over yourself, and stop letting the noise machine distract you.

We like General Patraeus. We expect nothing less than the best from an American Officer, and I believe the General is doing his best.

-- rabbitcore

You like him so much that you can't be bothered to spell his name correctly?

Yes, sadly, you may be right, rabbitcore - the general may indeed be doing his best. And that may not be good enough.

There's an old saying that "the generals in this war are the privates who survived the last war." That was thought up back when there was a bit more time between one war and the next, but the point still resonates: one may advance in the military simply by managing to survive. Even to the 4-star level, so it seems.

Petraeus has failed to do what virtually all the neocons have failed to do, which is to show genuine concern for the troops - to show that one really good reason to reduce troop strength and even withdraw entirely from Iraq is that FEWER AMERICAN SOLDIERS WOULD BE KILLED IN A SPECIOUS CAUSE.

Funny how no one ever mentions this part. To me, that's the most important part. Fewer dead American kids. Fewer dead Iraqis. Somehow, that seems more important to me than anything Petraeus or Bush or anyone else in the pro-war camp has ever said about this war.

Oh, and just as a closing point: who is the "we" you talk about in your comment? Is "rabbitcore" some kind of secret neocon cabal, or something? Is that a mouse in your pocket? Or are you just projecting?

"Well, al-Qaida is telling us that they think it's the central front. They might be lying. They've been known to do so, General.

- Rep. Brad Sherman (D-CA)

Geez. Ya think?

You really think that a 4-star general is so credulous that he really needs to be told this? That enemies in a war sometimes LIE to each other?

Based on results, the answer apparently is yes. He's either that dumb, or he thinks WE are that dumb.

It's the standard modus operandi of the Bush administration: say something stupid and intuitively and provably wrong, and dare the listener to prove you wrong.

Apparently, it still works like a charm. I mean, otherwise they wouldn't use the tactic so often, would they?

Rep. Sherman, I wouldn't head into any dark alleys any time soon. These people don't like being made to look like the fools they are. Sometimes they get ugly, and they have lots o' weapons.

Not sure whether the previous paragraph is intended for humorous/ironic effect or not.