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cecilbeanie

Published Letters: 324
Editor's Choice: 2

Friday, August 22, 2008 01:56 PM

@AKASmith, jebldmm, kstone

I read these letters and I have noticed that you all never respond to the letters that set forth well reasoned counter-arguments or cite facts/evidence that contradicts your positions. No. Instead you only respond to the letter writers who post dopey, sophomoric, nasty, assinine, comments. Try ignoring these guys and try responding to those of us who post reasonable arguments with reasonable arguments of your own. If you ignored those jerks they won't continue trying to yank your chains. They clearly can't do reasonable discourse - why engage them. So, how about starting with a response to this one that I posted in the "Un-Kerry" article comments (please don't tell me that you can't respond to something I posted to someone else):

@NYDem08:

Democracy issues: MI and FL was a huge issue for us. Four other states also moved up their primaries: NV, IA, SC and NH. None of these states were penalized as Obama was expected to win them all. MI and FL where Clinton polled to win were set to be penalized.

The above statement is inaccurate. All the primaries listed above had been moved by August 2007. (SEE: New York Times Election 2008 Guide, August 22, 2007.) Clinton was well ahead of Obama for most of 2007 both nationally and state-by-state.

SUMMER 2007 POLLS RESULTS FOR IOWA, NEVADA, NEW HAMPSHIRE AND SOUTH CAROLINA

August 18, Zogby poll (Iowa): Clinton 30% ; Obama 19%

August 16, Research 2000 poll (Nevada): Clinton 39%; Obama 19%

September 26, Zogby poll (New Hampshire): Clinton 38%; Obama 23%

September 27, Rasmussen (South Carolina): Clinton 43%; Obama 30%

Source: electoral-vote.com

It is not true that the above states were not penalized because Obama was projected to win them. At the time Florida was penalized (August 2007), Clinton was well ahead in IA, NV, NH and SC. At the time Michigan was penalized (December 2007), Clinton was still well ahead in these states. (See: Pew Poll results, below.)

The DNC imposed sanctions on Florida in August 2007. (Source: Washington Post, August 26, 2007.) The DNC imposed sanctions on Michigan in December. (Source: Washington Post, December 2, 2007.) In December 2007 Reuters/Zogby poll showed that, nationally, Clinton led Obama 40% to 32%. On December 2, 2007 the Pew Research Center released the following poll results:

Iowa: Clinton 31%; Obama 26%

New Hampshire: Clinton 38%; Obama 19%

South Carolina: Clinton 45%; Obama 31%

(There was no data on Nevada.)

Friday, August 22, 2008 02:20 PM

@jebldmm

RE: PUMAs you say "the 'movement' has not coalesced into a coherent group except in the minds of Obama fans who can't let go of the idea that there is some grand unified plot among Clinton supporter's to defeat Obama."

It is to laugh! I think Obama fans have made it pretty darn clear that we do not think that there is some "grand unified plot among Clinton supporter's to defeat Obama." What we think is that PUMA is a fraud, a Republican front to to try to throw the Obama campaign off balance. And, maybe at the same time to destroy Clinton's career.

Friday, August 22, 2008 04:17 PM

@KStone

Point taken. I do not know why only MI and FL were sanctioned and NV, IA, NH and SC were not. I only know that it had nothing to do with the fact that Clinton was ahead in the polls in MI and FL and not in those other states. The fact is she was ahead in NV, IA, NH, SC and MI and FL at the time sanctions were imposed on FL and MI.

Friday, August 22, 2008 04:20 PM

@AKASmith

Thank you for the response. I too have considered myself bad with numbers all of my life. At 51, I am realizing that I actually have a head for numbers, or could have had. But I was subject to the whole "girls don't do math" thing. At this point it is probably too late to do anything about it. I am finding that I understand numbers more than I thought I did over the years.

Saturday, August 23, 2008 07:12 AM
Original article: It's Biden

Two words

Two words for Hillary: grace; dignity.

Hillary should have started mending fences in June but what's done is done. Now is the time for her to start mending those fences. She needs to hit it out of the park for Obama when she speaks in Denver. She has to (finally) concede. She needs to graciously withdraw her name from nomination and release her delegates. Her speech should be about the party, about winning in November and must contain no hint of divisiveness. She must take on McCain not fellow party members.

She must show that she can put the good of the country ahead of her ambition to be President. Now is the time to move forward.

This is as much for her sake as it is for the country's. Hillary can't risk her future. She can do a lot in the Senate if she mends fences now and works her tail off to get Obama in the White House.

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