Letters to the Editor
Published Letters: 217 Editor's Choice: 9
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@ AKA Smith - Perhaps this is the source of our disagreement
[Read the article: Quote of the Day: Barack Obama ]
[Read more letters about this article: Here]You argue that men should have a say on whether or of not women should be offended by being called sweetie in a professional context.
First: No, that is not where I’m coming from, at all. Although now I think I can understand why you might hear it that way.
I don’t think it is desirable for *any* group of people to have “a say” in what “should” offend other people. Even if it were possible, which it is not. No one can ever control someone else’s mind like that. Thank God.
No, where I’m coming from is: certain phrases either offend a majority of people in a certain group, or they don’t. And if they do, that is clearly provable by looking at the common usage and experience of that phrase, in our culture.
“Should” or “should not” is not relevant to the reality, of whether or not that majority is offended. There is “no say” possible for **any** group in whether or not someone "should" or "should not" be offended. Any more than I have or *should* have a say in what actually offends you personally – or vice versa.
So it seems that you are misinterpreting my stance, of “let’s determine if it’s offensive to the majority of women, and let’s not discount men, as they would have heard of it if it was”,
as me saying, “we men as a group *should be* able to determine whether you women as a group *should be* be offended by it.
So we may just be in different arguments, there. Which would also explain why you didn’t get my multiple answers to your arguments.
Is that distinction clear?
Second: where I’m coming from, is to say men's opinion on a phrase being *actually* offensive and *actually, genuinely hurts a majority of that group*, in terms of *observable facts* - that's sexist
Do you understand? I’m talking about getting evidence about the actual interaction, as it occurs, and observing reality.
So, in the context of determining whether or not a phrase actually hurts women as a group – why do all men who disagree with you, deserve to be dismissed? And all women who disagree with you, for that matter?
Honestly, I think it's that kind of position that gives feminism a bad name.
Answer this: Should white people have a say on what names applied to black people that black people can find offensive?
I hope my explanation above outlined my stance on this. I will also now quote for you, below, from my previous message:
"I'm saying that, as a white man, I know that using the 'n word' is offensive to black people. THEREFORE, even tho I am not a woman, if 'sweetie' were anywhere near that universally offensive to women I would expect to know it."
That's my argument, again. Now that's it's there, please read it - again.
Now, to sum up:-
1) I'm not saying men - or any group - have "a say" in determining what names are and are not offensive to others.
I have NEVER said that. That is 100% something you are bringing to the table. Really. You are arguing with things that I have never said, at all.
2) What I **am** saying is, if "sweetie" was in fact as universally and automatically, undeniable sexist in any profressional context in the US as you think it is - I would have heard it before. Either being used in that context, or by a woman I know who was hurt and mad by it being used in that context.
And I am telling you that I have literally never heard "sweetie" have that tenor, in my entire life. Ever. Really.
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@AKA Smith - I can agree with that. Just doesn't mean "sweetie" is automatically sexist.
[Read the article: Quote of the Day: Barack Obama ]
[Read more letters about this article: Here]1. Click on my screen name and scroll through until you find the subject "Don't call me honey, I'm not sweet". There's an example of a male poster calling a female poster some "endearment" in an attempt to belittle her. Though I don't really believe you've *never* encountered this before.
Sure, I've seen sexism in action in the office before.
But where does that mean that using the word "sweetie" in a professional context, is in and of itself automatically sexist and condescending to a majority of women in the US?
Because that's what would have to be true, for using "sweetie" in *any* professional setting to automatically be sexist.
2. The whole "universal" thing is your argument. I'm not getting into it any more.
You may be misunderstanding my meaning. But, that's fine.
3. Were I a man, here's the rule of thumb I'd follow in a professional or social setting (because it's what I follow as a woman):
....Those all sound quite good and reasonable, and I agree they make for a pleasant and clear professional workplace.
I just think that people who deviate from those rules of thumb, specifically by using the phrase "sweetie", are not automatically being sexist or condescending. And so, they should not be automatically judged and condemned as sexist for same.